An Unusual Collection

Discussion in 'Gallery' started by oldravendale, 4 November 2018.

  1. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    From top to bottom of the last batch the locations are:

    Cockfosters - although of similar design the station roof is too low for Uxbridge and they are tube train height platforms.

    Hounslow West - this is well before the new station on the Heathrow Airport realignment and you can just read the station name boards. Again tube train height platforms.

    Hounslow West. The silver stock in the photo is 1959 tube stock as there are two headlamps.

    From the evidence I think the photos in this collection are taken during the 1959 - 1961 period.

    We'll wait for the next installment.... :)
  2. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    I wonder if the photographer visited the stations at the end of the lines.

    So far we have West Ruislip (Central), Uxbridge (Piccadilly and Met), Cockfosters (Piccadilly), Hounslow West (Piccadilly) and Watford (Met).
  3. eastsidepilot

    eastsidepilot Western Thunderer

  4. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    I've done a bit of digging on this one and can say with certainty this is Watford Met with the original goods shed in the background. I've managed to find some photos of the goods shed before it was demolished in favour of a housing estate.
  5. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    Thank you Dave and Col. Fantastic work - particularly to work out where the cab photo was taken.

    I know that you've all been waiting for an update about my fishing trip from Hayling Island. :)) Having left our digs without breakfast at 06.30 to a grey, cold and uninviting morning we were out of the harbour by 0730. I caught three inedible fish (a dogfish, a wrasse and an eel - in a bream competition:drool:) during the whole day, got cold and wet. So let's move on.......

    As I'm absolutely knackered I've been around the house today and managed to deal with a total of six photos. Is this London Transport G/Q23 stock? It's certainly a photo which demonstrates the variety of stocks available which made London Transport so interesting at the time. The one on the left clearly has a Mansion House destination which is Circle and District line - I suspect it's on a Circle Line train - as the one on the right is bound for Upminster which makes it deffo a District Line train. This can be confirmed by the combination of lights on the cab fronts - I think. What I don't know - in fact have no idea about - is the location.

    img387 - Copy (5).jpg

    This is another standard stock train. No idea where..... Any ideas?

    img387 - Copy (6).jpg

    A Central Line train bound for Epping using standard stock. Location again unknown but if this can be worked out does it give a clue to the one above as well?

    img388 - Copy (2) - Copy - Copy.jpg

    And now for something completely different - with a degree of deja vu. A class 24 with a Class 501 alongside. Funnily enough I think this is at Croxley Green. It's (probably) D5016 or D5018. One of the side panels is removed for some sort of service, I guess - I've always assumed that the maintenance was carried out at the main sheds of the time, but in retrospect I suppose that it could be done anywhere.

    img388 - Copy (3).jpg

    Another cab shot. There's nothing to help us decide where or, in fact, what.

    img388 - Copy (4).jpg
    This is clearly a 501 unit. Stonebridge Park, I think.

    img388 - Copy (5).jpg

    If any of the data can be confirmed or gaps filled in I'll be grateful again.

  6. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    The cab shot is the same 501 as the last shot I suspect, cab side window is open.
    oldravendale likes this.
  7. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    Ealing Broadway. The stock is K27 as the clerestory is raked down at the ends - G23 stock does not do this. Up until recently some District Line trains terminated at Mansion House which was the original city terminus of the District Line. Both trains would have used the District Line as Upminster trains were never routed via the Met Circle Line. I think during this period Circle Line trains were made up of P stock.

    Ealing Broadway - the photographer now has his back to District Line trains in the photo above.

    West Ruislip with the main GC&GW joint line in the background - the main line platform railings give the location away.

    Mmmm, more LT terminal stations :) - I wonder if the photographer had a LT train rover ticket to ride to the ends of the lines? Only leaves:
    Edgware Road, Wimbledon, Richmond and Upminster (District)
    New Cross, New Cross Gate and Shoreditch or Whitechapel (East London Line)
    Stanmore, Elephant and Castle and Watford Junction (Bakerloo)
    Aldwych (Piccadilly)
    Morden, Edgware, High Barnet and Mill Hill East (Northern)
    Epping and Ongar (Central)
    Hammersmith and Barking (Hammersmith and City)
    Aldgate (Met)

    Cannot include the Victoria Line as it did not open until 1968.

    Nevertheless it's a fascinating collection you've unearthed here Brian.
    oldravendale likes this.
  8. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    Again, Mick and Dave, more info of great value to me. Thank you. More questions will follow but it's an interesting hypothesis that the photographer may be doing an end to end tour of the LT lines.

    Here are the submissions for today. Again, another reasonable number of photos as I caught up with some home time.

    The first one is, I believe, at Rickmansworth, looking North. I'm uncertain whether the photo is taken from "T" or loco hauled stock. Circumstantially there appears to be smoke over a siding centre left. Could this be from a loco to haul the train from Rickmansworth to Aylesbury? Frankly I'm doubtful, as I suspect it's a little later, ie after the line to Amersham had been electrified but there's no evidence to support this either way. I'm basing my guess only on the assumed dates of other photos in the collection.

    img388 - Copy (6).jpg

    This is possibly the most interesting or at least intriguing of the set. This can only be surmise on my part, but could this be the yard of the LNWR station at Rickmansworth, taken from the Met line train above? I really can't remember at this distance in time whether this would be the view from the Met Line although I certainly remember the LNWR station itself, at least from road level as I was always intrigued by it.

    img389 - Copy (2).jpg

    Below is certainly LMS stock rather than a 501 unit or Oerlikon. I'm unsure about any other value this picture may have. This could be Croxley Green but I'm voting for Stonebridge Park again.

    img389 - Copy (3).jpg
    More of the LMS stock, potentially on the same occasion so again at Stonebridge Park?

    img389 - Copy (4).jpg
    This is the first of two very similar photos, to the left 501 stock which appears to be coupled to an LMS unit, again probably at Stonebridge Park.

    img389 - Copy (5) - Copy.jpg
    .....and this is the second shot.

    img389 - Copy (6) - Copy.jpg
    Finally, and definitely at Stonebridge Park, one of, if not the best, of a 501 unit.

    img389 - Copy (7) - Copy.jpg

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  9. eastsidepilot

    eastsidepilot Western Thunderer

    Looks like the old station at Rickmansworth Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland but taken from St Mary's church tower I'd say.

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  10. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    I reckon you're absolutely on the money there, Col. Looking at the map the old station is too far from the Met line. The river can also be seen on the photo. Thanks, Col. Another unknown solved.

  11. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    This is definitely Rickmansworth Met - taken from T stock as there is no loco moving onto the train nor the Bo-Bo which would have brought the train in. Like you I believe this was after the line was electrified to Amersham and possibly after the cessation of the steam hauled Aylesbury trains - which makes these photos even more interesting. The LT Aylesbury trains were steam hauled until the DMUs (and BR) took over the services in September 1961.

    The second - as confirmed by Col is Rickmansworth Church St which also served the canal wharves.

    There are some nice details of the LMS stock in this photo.
  12. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    Dave - once again that's super (that's become an awful word but I use it in it's original connotation) information. These photos will have a load of info attached to them which was simply not available from the album.

    So.... to the efforts today.

    There are very few well exposed and printed photos in the collection. (Once again, how I wish I could source the negs) but this is one of them. This is without doubt Stonebridge Park and shows, unless someone tells me otherwise, two of the LMS units next to an Oerlikon set.

    img389 - Copy.jpg

    This is (or may not be to the less involved than I) an interesting and quizzical picture. Ignore the BR standard tender to the extreme right - I'm interested in the unit. It appears to be a driving motor car and a driving trailer of one of the Oerlikon units. Were these used as shunters? Is there any previous evidence of this? I'd bet (not very much) money that this is Stonebridge Park again.

    img390 - Copy (2).jpg
    Not much more to say about the below except that it's a 501 unit. The damage to the image on the right suggests to me that the film was home processed and slipped off the reel. Not a lot to be done about that in the short term but repairable given time and assuming the image is worth it which, in truth, it probably isn't.

    img390 - Copy (3).jpg
    Stonebridge Park again. The image is very under developed. It's also streaky which suggests to me a lack of agitation during development. However, after fiddling around with the density and contrast I've come up with this. In the foreground is M61142. It and the associated unit looks to be brand new - look at the white unblemished roof. The unit behind is an Oerlikon and behind that another 501.

    img390 - Copy (4) M61142.jpg
    Another view which looks to be from the same roll of film and on the same day. Here, though, the "new" 501 unit has another to the left and the Oerlikon unit to the right of that, ending with the 501 seen in the first photo.
    img390 - Copy (5).jpg

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  13. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    Here's the efforts for today.

    Here's that shunter unit again - if that's what it is.

    img390 - Copy (6).jpg

    This LMS unit appears to be on accommodation bogies and also appears to be attached to an Oerlikon unit. Or maybe this is the shunter being used to drag the LMS unit out of works?

    img390 - Copy.jpg
    Where is this? Certainly it's a T stock train as the vehicles can be identified as trailer 9793 nearest camera and motor car 2746.

    img391  9793 trailer and 2746 motor car - Copy (3).jpg
    This is probably the best shot so far of a T stock train in its natural environment but we know not where.

    img391  Mid right pic is identified as Croxley Green Junction - Copy (2).jpg

    And, to quote the oracle, now for something entirely different. Standard 4 2-6-0 76044 appears to be shunting. Is this from a passing train and if so where? That goods shed must be a clue.
    img391  Mid right pic is identified as Croxley Green Junction - Copy (4).jpg

    And now to something entirely unexpected. This is certainly a rail tour of some kind. The station sign at top left has four letters barely readable, but they appear to be "TION". The loco could be a Midland 2P 4-4-0, but I can't identify what's on the other end of the train. Frustratingly I'd saved a reference to some on line photos of what I believe to be the same train which I've now lost. Bearing in mind the following shot (that'll come tomorrow) I believe the tour included Croxley Green.

    img391  Station Sign reads TION - Copy (5).jpg

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  14. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Photos three and five are the same location, same goods shed and in photo three I'll wager that guards van is on the end of the 16t the Std 4 is shunting, solve one and you solve both. The station has had some work done, perhaps platform extensions for new services with longer trains.

    The two coach set is as you probably surmise, a yard donkey for shunting stock around.

    I'd hazard a guess that the last photo will be Watford Junction, this being the branch platforms on the east side and the lamp shade has TION on the end (top left).

    The trailing engine might be what my father and his mates around Crewe called a 'Clog', Midland 4F 0-6-0, it certainly looks like a Fowler cab and tender.
    Last edited: 21 May 2019 at 21:57
  15. daifly

    daifly Western Thunderer

  16. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    Thanks Mick. Yep, reckon you're right about the goods shed. And if that is Watford Junction - much changed now - that'll be the St Albans Abbey branch.

    Very helpful stuff.

  17. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    That'll be the one, and as suspected, a Midland 4F 0-6-0 on the tail end.
    Last edited: 21 May 2019 at 22:15
  18. oldravendale

    oldravendale Western Thunderer

    You are absolutely on the button, Dave. The train reporting number is the same and so is the wreath. It's not the site I picked up the earlier info from, but it's certainy confirmation.

    Many thanks.

  19. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    Amersham. The second one is taken from the end of what is now the island platform. The new line the Aylesbury trains use can just be seen diverging in the background next to the van/brake van at the far end of the goods shed.

    I think this is just north of Chorleywood on a relatively straight section of line.

    As identified above these are the St Albans Abbey platforms at Watford Junction.
  20. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    Coming back to this photo P stock was tested on the line to Amersham during 1961 therefore I think this is one of these test trains.