Gladiator 7mm GCR 11F 4-4-0

P A D

Western Thunderer
It was not a very productive session this afternoo, but I did get a few more details on the loco. The upper front lamp bracket on these locos is fixed to the handrail, so after bending the rail from the etched strip provided, a flat was filed on the top of the pillar, to facilitate the joint. Fortunately the smokebox door is removable via the simple "bayonet" fixing, as I had to hold the lamp iron from above using a short length of coffee stirrer and solder it from the underside. Much earlier to do with the white metal casting safely out of the way. I made it that way to allow the addition of a chip and speaker at a later date if required, but I also note that the door ring was bare metal so it will be easier for Warren to be able to remove it.
20191030_184123.jpg

Lower down the lamp irons were fixed to the running plate and valve chest cover, and the buffers were epoxied to the buffer beam.
20191030_184044.jpg

And a view from the front. I note that the buffer beam will be lined, so I'll make some mods to allow the steam pipe to be fixed to the chassis. I've already fixed the one on the tender to the buffer beam, so I'll have of revisit that. The buffer head on the right in the photo has been fettled to remove the machining marks, but the other one is still to do
20191030_183944.jpg

The only other parts that were fixed today were the sandbox filler lids behind the grab rail on the running plate. I note from prototype photos that there is an oil box either side on the inside of the frame just to the rear of the smokebox where the two rivets are. I'll knock them up from square brass rod and solder them in place. Easy to do with the boiler being removable. I used to think that it was a waste of time doing that, but having now built 6 locos that way, I can see the benefits both from the building and painting point of view.
20191030_180634.jpg

Hopefully tomorrow's session will more productive and I can get all the remaining castings on. The cast brass ship's wheel that Tony Geary kindly sent me arrived today, so I'll put that on the tender as well.
20191030_183905.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
I had to abort mission today and go pick up my daughter at short notice, so another not very productive session. However, before the call came I did manage a couple of jobs. Here's a comparison of the etched and cast ship's wheels. I could have fettled up the etched one to improve it but the cast one takes the biscuit. Thanks again to Tony Geary for letting me have it.
20191031_165733.jpg

Definitely an improvement over the original.
20191031_165703.jpg
20191031_165635.jpg

To fit the steam pipe to the chassis and leave the bottom edge of the bufferbeam clear for lining out, I added a strip of waste fret behind the front spacer and soldered the steam pipe to this.
20191031_165556.jpg

I found some finer wire to make the chain and will replace the one on the tender when I refit it to the chassis.
20191031_165512.jpg

When the chassis is installed in the body, the bottom edge of the bufferbeam just touches the steam pipe.
20191031_163644.jpg

I must add the handle to the valve.
20191031_163714.jpg

Just needs the coupling to finish off the front end.
20191031_165426.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 
Last edited:

paulc

Western Thunderer
I had to abort mission today and go pick up my daughter at short notice, so another not very productive session. However, before the call came I did manage a couple of jobs. Here's a comparison of the etched and cast ship's wheels. I could have fettled up the etched one to improve it but the cast one takes the biscuit. Thanks again to Tony Geary for letting me have it.
View attachment 113522

Definitely an improvement over the original.
View attachment 113523
View attachment 113526

To fit the steam pipe to the chassis and leave the bottom edge of the bufferbeam clear for lining out, I added a strip of waste fret behind the front spacer and soldered the steam pipe to this.
View attachment 113527

I found some finer wire to make the chain and will replace the one on the tender when I refit it to the chassis.
View attachment 113528

When the chassis is installed in the body, the bottom edge of the bufferbeam just touches the steam pipe.
View attachment 113525

I must add the handle to the valve.
View attachment 113524

Just needs the coupling to finish off the front end.
View attachment 113529

Cheers,
Peter
Hi Peter , this is a fantastic build . On the smokebox door i think the left hand handrail knob has dropped so the handrail isn't straight . Hopefully an easy fix or its a trick of the camera .
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Hi Peter , this is a fantastic build . On the smokebox door i think the left hand handrail knob has dropped so the handrail isn't straight . Hopefully an easy fix or its a trick of the camera .

Hi Paul,
Many thanks.

It is the door casting that is not lined up properly. It is removable via a simple bayonet fitting to allow for a chip/speaker to be added later if desired and for the ring on the casting to be painted to represent bare metal. It tends to work round under it's own volition, but I've tightened it up a bit.

Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Yesterday I had the opportunity to visit Barrow Hill and take some photos of the preserved D11 Butler Henderson. Its bit late in the build but still useful. A member of the staff allowed me to go into the cab, but I also brought along my daughter's selfie stick to increase the reach of my arm for some of those inaccessible areas. You can buy them for a quid in Pound Saver and I would highly recommend them for this type of photo expedition (assuming you are using a smart phone with a reasonable camera). Here are a selection of the images.

The crank in the tender steps which I missed and will correct.
20191102_103619.jpg

The tender rear top plate showing the water pick up, lifting brackets and a drain hole. To the right you can just make out a support bracket for the rear of the rave. There's one on the left in the same position. Clearly there is a lot of riveting around the perimeter of the coping and the water filler.


20191102_104112.jpg

There is a drain hole on the other side as well.
20191102_104051.jpg

Part way along the left hand rim of the bunker is a hook for the end of the fire irons when stowed on the cruciform fire iron brack at the front.
20191102_104516.jpg

The fire iron bracket is mounted further forward on the curve of the coping than I placed it. Something else to correct. The handles to the water valves are much longer than on the cast part provided, but I wonder if these are original?
20191102_104429.jpg

The right hand rear tender step and guard iron.
20191102_103718.jpg

Unfortunately, the images are loading in a random order, not the order I took them, so I'll be flitting back and forth.
This shows the front guard iron position right up to the buffer beam, which can only be done by shortening the running plated and valance as I have done.
20191102_103027.jpg

The rear buffer beam. Lots of lining to do hear both on the beam and the buffers, so it's just as well the steam and vacuum pipe will be out of the way on the model.20191102_103735.jpg

This is the oil pot at the rear of the smokebox that I mentioned in a previous post. It is actually bracketed off the smokebox not the frame as I thought. There's one on the other side ad well.
20191102_103309.jpg

Here you can see the detail at the cab end of the ejector pipe and also a small hatch possibly for access to the reversing mechanism for lubrication. Both these features can be seen in the works grey photo of 502 Zeebrugge (the subject of the model) posted earlier so are original fittings.
20191102_103522.jpg

A close up of the reversing rod and support.
20191102_103458.jpg

The front buffer beam.
20191102_103102.jpg


A closd up of left rear buffer shows the red lining between the burt umber stock and the black base. Most if not all the burnt umber panels have this red lining.20191102_103747.jpg

Back in the cab, this view shows the livery on the rear of the draught screen, burnt umber panel red lined with black border.
20191102_104555.jpg

The hand brake, fire iron and curved extension plate. I've not curved this plate so another correction is required.
20191102_104439.jpg

More to follow.
Cheers,
Peter
 
Last edited:

P A D

Western Thunderer
Under the firebox there is a support bracket for the brake pull rod and a return spring on the rear cross beam. This a view from the left hand side and again these are original features visible on 502 Zeebrugge. There is also a pull rod running along the left side of the ash pan. What it operates, I don't know but it is only on the left side.
20191102_111910.jpg

This view of the left hand splasher, shows a run of oil pipes from the cab along the top and then down behind the splasher, with 4 fastenings along their length. I believe they are original, but the wash out plug above the splasher (on both sides) is not. At least they are not visible on early prototype photos that I have seen.
20191102_113014.jpg

I still cannot remember what this gizmo is, but apparently it was replaced on the LNER builds with a snifting

valve behind the chimney. Note that there is a rod from it running into the handrail no doubt to a control lever or wheel in the cab.
20191102_111539.jpg

A wider angle view of the earlier left hand ash pan shot.
20191102_111855.jpg

Here wd can see a pipe, possibly a drain for condensation on the large ejector pipe. Again itcan be see on early photos so an original fitting.
20191102_110016.jpg

The very rusty water scoop. Note the support trusses not mention or provided in the kit.
20191102_110250.jpg

A closd up of the weight shaft bearing, the shaft and counterweights. Note that the lever dropping vertically from the counterweight lever is on the inside. The instructions show it incorrectly on the outside.
20191102_111617.jpg

The oil box ag thd rear of the smokebox on the left hand side.
20191102_111607.jpg

The water scoop from the other side.
20191102_110708.jpg

The blow down valve under the boiler, between the counterweights.
20191102_105806.jpg

And from the left hand side.
20191102_111814.jpg

The reversing rod support bracket. Above it the additional wash out plug.
20191102_111343.jpg
Left hand sandpipe and support bracket.
20191102_111753.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Well, if I did not make any changes or additions after having made the visit to Barrow Hill, then it would be a wasted visit.

I intend to correct some of the errors and add further details, including a representation of the return spring on the brake gear. It is clearly visible in profile in the photo of Zeebrugge, but not clear enough to make about what it is. If you look closely, you can also see the pipe union on the ejector pipe in front of the cab and the small inspection flap on the top of the reverser mechanism cover. Having seen the crank in the tender steps on Tim Watson's 2 mm versions, I can now discern it in these photos. The lower photo is of course and LNER build for use in Scotland but these features can also be seen. Tim Watson's build also highlighted the curve in the front tender extensions I had also missed. Wish I'd bitten the bullet sooner and driven down to Barrow Hill.
39526865415_0a0f151278_b.jpg
26247759398_8164f5477a_b.jpg

Some more progress on the build. The counterweights and links were assemble off the model as was the reversing crank and weight shaft
20191102_173401.jpg

The white metal weight shaft bearings soldered to the dummy frames.
20191102_173420.jpg

And with the counterweight sub assembly and reversing crank added. I'm leaving the reversing rod loose to ease painting after which it can be slotted into the cover at the rear and the front end secured to the crank with a drop of super glue. It will be an easy job to add the inspection flap to the reversing cover, made from brass shin and a tiny rivet to represent the handle.
20191102_175416.jpg

Another scratch built addition is this little gizmo at the boiler smokebox joint. Again it is just a push fit for final fixing after lining out.
20191102_175720.jpg

On t'other side of the smokebox, the cast gizmo bas been epoxied in place between the handrails. I overlooked to remove the oozed resin while it was part cured, so it will be a little more difficult to tidy it up. Wash out plugs, midsole covers and safety valve base also added.
20191102_212435.jpg

Here's a right hand broadside showing the reversing rod slotted in place. Looks like the support bracket needs straightening. For ease of fixing, I may bracket the oil boxes behind the smoke box off the frames but we'll see.
20191102_212550.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
Chimneys are always a vexed thing. I think the taper from the base to three-quarters the way up needs cutting onto. Some GCR chimneys were like that one on your model, but the 11E Directors had more 'vertical' between the top and bottom tapers.
 

Genghis

Western Thunderer
These detail shots are really useful. Incidentally the photo of Butler Henderson on the LNER society website shows the tender with the curly U fireiron cradle, but other works photos show the cruciform support. Does anyone know when this change was made? (My RCTS books may tell me but they are there and I am here..............)
The coupling rods for this kit have their own etch so it looks like a commission to draw up a slightly beefier set is in order. The side-on view of model and prototype is illuminating.
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Hi Larry,
The chimney looks a bit overweight to me, but I didn't fancy trying to turn it and mess it up as it's not mine. However, I may have a dabble with the spare taller later chimney and see if I can make it look like Zeebrugge's.

David,
If you ever decide to add reference photos with your instructions, feel free to use any of mine. The coupling rods have the same fluting on both sides, so I intend to try filing the inner face of one to see if I can improve the appearance. If it works I'll do both and swap them over and if not, leave the filed face on the inside. The etched rods are of course missing the boss on the underside at the hole.
Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
It's not so clear from this photo (couldn't get the phone any higher even with the selfie stick), but the safety valve appear to be slightly recessed in the plinth in photos seen on the internet .
20191102_110843.jpg

So, I counter sank the holes in the plinth by hand with a 5mm drill bit.
20191105_095838.jpg

Apart from adding the safety valves, the rest of the session was spent correcting errors I made on the tender. In the end I could not live with the water filler/pick up cover as it was, especially as Tim Watson got it right in 2mm. :D I soaked the glued joints in cellulose thinner to soften them and was then able to carefully prise off both boxes using a chisel ended craft blade.
20191105_095537.jpg

After cutting off the inner part of the main cover it was reduced in size, the handle re-centered and then all three refitted. I took the opportunity to scribe a line at the rear of the small covers and add hinges to all three boxes while they were off the model. The etched line for the water filler lid is too far back, but I decided to live with that. I still need to add the supports for the raves.
20191105_095616.jpg

At the front, the fire iron bracket was removed, a new one made and refitted in the correct position on the inner face of the rave. The hole for the original fitting was filled with a rivet and still needs a bit more grinding with a burr to tidy it up. The side plate extensions either side of the footplate have been removed. I need to make new ones slightly wider and curved to match the beading/handrail support. The brake standard was in the wrong place so that was removed, the hole plated over with a thin sheet of brass and the standard refitted. The original position lined up with the crank on the brake rigging on the chassis, but that was in the wrong place also.
20191105_094936.jpg

Inside the bunker I have added the hook for the end of the fire irons. The position is a bit of a guesstimate working from the photo I took.
20191105_095449.jpg


Here's where the brake crank should be. The shaft extends beyond the tender frames and is supported on a riveted on bracket with the crank to the outside. I had the crank inside the frame in the space between that and the chassis.
20191102_110935.jpg

So after a bit of scratch building. The shaft from the crank just butts up against the end of the one on the chassis, so that the chassis may still be removed. Again, I have been copying Mr. Watson's 2mm effort and have corrected the footsteps. The upper steps were removed and the mounting bent downwards and then refitted after cranking the backing plate.
20191105_095211.jpg

Here's the rear step on the same side.
20191105_095259.jpg

And continuing with the easy painting features, the steam pipe has been removed from the buffer beam and fixed to a bracket on the tender chassis and the chain replaced from thinner wire.
20191105_095642.jpg

And with the body in place it looks like its monuted on the buffer beam. Having seen Warren's work on Mick Bayliss's D11 and David Hill's Atlantic, he could probably paint this in the dark. With that in mind, I might just fix all the lose parts in place to give him a bit of a challenge! :)
20191105_095036.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 
Last edited:

Tim Watson

Western Thunderer
Those are some really useful pictures Peter. I am awaiting some hard NS and spring steel wire of the correct size for the various handrails and fire iron fittings on my engine.

Those are some very helpful views of the safety valves, I had presumed they were recessed; not sure whether to bother making them in a non tarnishing alloy as they are so small.

These GC engines are just too subtle with their curves in all sorts of areas and the chimneys are particularly awkward.

Tim
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Those are some really useful pictures Peter. I am awaiting some hard NS and spring steel wire of the correct size for the various handrails and fire iron fittings on my engine.

Those are some very helpful views of the safety valves, I had presumed they were recessed; not sure whether to bother making them in a non tarnishing alloy as they are so small.

These GC engines are just too subtle with their curves in all sorts of areas and the chimneys are particularly awkward.

Tim

Hi Tim,
This image, cropped from one I found on the internet shows the safety valves recessed. It also shows the hinged inspection panel on
the reverser cover, that I assume would be on Valour. However, it will be very small in 2mm scale.

Any thoughts on whether the cruciform or curly U fire iron bracket would have been original GCR fittings?

Cheers,
Peter
20191105_190820.jpg
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
These are the replacement tender side extensions along with the originals. I also made a couple of support brackets for the raves, the ones I included in the kit not being suitable for the self trimming tender.
20191105_192152.jpg

Here they are after fixing in place and adding the handrail.
20191105_192104.jpg

Here is a view of the repositioned brake crank showing the gap in the shaft that allows removal of the tender chassis.20191105_192028.jpg

The support brackets for the raves were epoxied in place as I did not want to risk the flange and bracket separating.
20191105_191918.jpg

T'other side. I still need to drill the two drain holes either side of the water filler.
20191105_191941.jpg

On the loco, I made the union on the ejector pipe, but have still to add the inspection panel on the reverser cover.
20191105_191854.jpg

Finally a couple more photos of Butler Henderson. A view of the boiler top taken from the running plate with the phone extended on the selfie stick. Didn't realise I had missed the safety valves but if shows the cladding joint and fixings ax well as the cleat on the front firebox cladding band. Clearly the top part of the firebox cladding is a separate sheet.
20191102_112532.jpg

And looking towards the chimney.
20191102_112541.jpg

Cheers,
Peter
 

P A D

Western Thunderer
Many thanks Larry.

I'm coming round to swapping the fire iron bracket to the curly U one, but where did this cruciform version come from?

Cheers,
Peter
 
Top