7mm The Rise and Fall of Holme Lacy?

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Good progress Simon. Will have to read you explanation of relay interlocking again when I've not just woken up!
 

Neil

Western Thunderer
At the risk of having one of those granny and egg sucking moments it would be well worth sealing the edges of the Stirling board with paint or varnish. I've used the stuff for the lower baseboard level of Northern Town and it has swollen up on the edges, even though the garage that it lives in is pretty dry.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
Neil,
good point that I hadn't really considered - I had only thought of sealing the top surface to make the cassettes slide a little easily. As my shed is yet to be insulated and relies on a dehumidfiier to keep the moistue down..... The Back End spent most of the last winter inside as a box.
Thanks
Simon
 

Wagonman

Western Thunderer
I'm no expert, but shouldn't the colliery line behind the platform have a trap point linked to the ground signal 6, and probably the advanced starter 2 should be more, er, advanced – like off scene entirely? Still needed for the interlocking sequence presumably.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
In a Mainwaring voice. " Ahh. I wondered when you would spot that".
Both the branch and the 'Yard' (a factory making widget flanges) need a catch or trap. The yard one is almost impossible to fit in because of space between the two points but I have seen a photo of one interwoven with a point but need to find the photo. As to the branch, complete incompetence. The advanced starter and the home are positioned for aesthetic and it's my train set reasons!;) And one of them should be higher or lower than the other for sighting purposes.
 

simond

Western Thunderer
I know the answer (at least, an answer) to that one. Brent.

piccy is in David J Smith’s GWR Switch & Crossing Practice, page 72.

and another on page 73.


cheers
Simon
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
Simon,
thanks. I'll take a peek when I go out to the shed. Looks like I have some track laying to do and I'll need a bigger box.
Simon
 

John Duffy

Western Thunderer
The trap point issue was very common here, where the GNSR laid out its yards and was then told by the inspectorate that even they needed to fit trap points. The solution was to integrate it into the first point;

BALLINDALLOCH yard point 2.jpg

Complicated but would make a great talking point (sorry!) as its something i've never seen modelled.

John
 

Phil O

Western Thunderer
Reasonably easy to do in Templot, I think there has been a thread recently on the forum on this very subject. I did a long while ago when I thought about modelling Arley on the Severn valley.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
Phil,
I tend to not use Templot these days and instead use the figures from the David J Smith book on GWR track work to draw in CAD. In this case I will just lay out the catch points on the track bed and build in situ.

The branch catch point is easy as it will be a variant of a E type and there is plenty of room. The Amalgamated Flange Widget catch is a pig as the obvious place is across the baseboard joint. Young male bovines spring to mind.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
Well half way there with this little problem.
Half an hour in David J Smith’s GWR Switch & Crossing Practice gave me an education about GW catch points. The book is so dry that it felt like hours were spent studying it but it is the authority so it is well worth working with. The branch could be solved very simply with a Type B catch. There is, of course, a gentle gradient away from the running lines;).
DSC02627a.jpg
This little beauty brings another attribute. They were worked by a detector on the point that controls the branch and then a detector on the catch won't allow the ground disk to be pulled unless the catch is pulled. Yippeee! No extra wiring and no more dodgy crapentry to build a new control box!!
DSC02628a.jpg
The catch point for Amalgamated Widget Flange's works is more of a problem. Where it should go is too small and spans the baseboard joint (there's only one!:mad:). The 10ft loose heel switch is sitting where the catch should be. I'm not sure what do about this. Shifting the point into the left hand baseboard would make it impossible to get into the siding inside the works. An alternative would be to do away with Amalgamated and put a small goods shed near the running lines and a mileage siding outside it towards the edge of the baseboard. This would entail lifting the yard track work and placing a more GW bit of track in it's place. Trouble is that I have no more underlay. Cardboard packaging as an underlay? For even suggesting it that's me out of the Tufty Club and the Tut-tuts in high dudgen!
Stay safe and happy.
Simon
 

Phil O

Western Thunderer
Hi Simon, can you please show a wider shot showing the turnouts in full and any adjacent lines. I might have a solution to your catch point problem.
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
Here you go Phil. Space is very tight!
DSC02629a.jpg
The point in the yard cannot move without me moving the factory building to the left in this view. A very sharp reverse curvature starts immediately off screen to the left to the line nearest to the running line. The only way I can think to honour the 6'6" requirement on clearance on the derailed vehicle from the running line is to have two catches within the yard point and for that point to be on railway property.
Looking forward to seeing your suggestion
Simon
 

John Duffy

Western Thunderer
Hi Simon, I’m not up on GWR practice but are you not talking about trap points? My understanding is that a catch point was situated on a mainline to deal with runaways, whereas trap points were used to protect passenger lines against stray movements from yards etc.

John
 

SimonT

Western Thunderer
John
I can only quote from David J Smith's book.
"In the GWR Rule Book of 1923 reference was made to 'safety points', whilst in the 1933 Rule Book, and the 1945 reprint, the term'trap points' was used, meaning in each case switches intended to divert or derail any vehicle moving without authorisation from a siding or a loop towards a running line, but among permanent way staff they were invariably known as catch points, and were described as such in documents and drawings. Only with the advent of nationalisation, under the pervasive LMS influence, was the rule book appelation ultimately adopted."

So, on the GWR, those who did things called them catch points and the blunties in admin called them trap points. All the GWR drawings in the chapter are labeled 'Catch Point' by the original draughtsman. There is a section on runaway catch points described by Smith and these were just long lead single tongue catch points spring loaded open. There are complicated rules describing their position in relation to the Home signal.

See what I mean about the dry style? A 73 word sentence!

Simon
PS, I suspect that your example in the photograph is the way to do it. If only I could find a GW example!
 

John Duffy

Western Thunderer
Excellent, the more one finds out, the more one is confused! The GWR must have gone out of their way to be contrary.

The layout's looking good.

John
 

richard carr

Western Thunderer
The layout is looking great Simon, I can't imagine anyone is going to notice that there really should be a trap point between those two pints.


Richard
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
I suspect that your example in the photograph is the way to do it. If only I could find a GW example!
Simon
It's not fully visible but the turnout on the extreme right of this view of Liskeard might 'point' the way. There was undoubtedly another catch point in the stock rail hidden by the Box to trap the other siding.
Dave
 
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