7mm: A Tale of Two 40s

iak63

iak63

Western Thunderer
Amazing quality of workmanship/craftsmanship... :cool:
This beasties body deserves to get mobile because its just got "it" to a tee.

Whooooosh!!! :thumbs:
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
Steph Dale said:
Richard,

In terms of it's completion I'll quickly mention that there's no over-riding drive to make the inner frames in brass (or indeed any other metal). If you are comfortable with the idea then there's no reason they shouldn't be made in styrene; 0.060" with brass bushing can work very well (and helps with split axles). However, while you've got Laurie's attention, couldn't you ask him for a set of the inners from the JLTRT 40 or 45?

One thought I have had relates to the construction of the body; has it got motor cut-outs? If not, are you happy to cut them? There aren't many diesel drive solutions that keep the motorisation within the height of the bogie. Otherwise, I tend to agree that the ABC motor bogie and its off-the-shelf-ness and solidity must appeal, although it then ceases to be a quick build; you may have to wait some months for their arrival!

One thought (did I mention this to you at Telford?) would be to build something around the PRMRP bogie etch. I've just looked at their site and they're £19.50ea inc. bearings for the 6-wheel variant.

Steph
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Hi Steph

You did mention the PRMRP bogie etch, and I did consider that. In the end I went for 2 x ABC RTR bogies. The cost premium (assuming the alternative was an ABC diesel drive with Delrin chain) is not huge, and I was certainly prepared to pay it for my time saving. In addition I will have a relatively heavy, full length power unit that will provide support for the buffer beam. I won't have to weight the plastic body nearly as much as I would otherwise have to. For those reasons, I didn't go for either the styrene or JLTRT options.

There are motor cut outs in the body which I am happy to enlarge as necessary, but I shall try to build a metal frame that fits exactly inside the body to strengthen the lower body sides and provide mountings for the bogies, water tank, and any extra weight. You were right, by the way - there is a 12 week waiting time for the bogies which will undoubtedly mean a pause in the project, before it's begun!

Richard
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
mickoo said:
Yup, that ticks all the boxes:thumbs: very accomplished work in any material, a view inside would be most informative as to how he formed the cant rail curvature and kept it a constant radius for its full length, especially around the engine room grill area.

Heat formed in a mould I believe.

Ok what you have is a disc fitted, Stones Vapor boiler class 40, so your numbers are 201-259/ 267-286/ 305-324 to narrow it further is difficult as Oldham is fringe LMR country for 40's so I reckon it might be a Leeds or Carlisle loco, though Newton Heath was always a hot spot for them in later days. But if we add Crewe and Longsight in then it's going to be 201-236/ 267-269/ 305-324 the holes are ER or ScR or odd ones that probably would not get there. Having said that, you could get a York ER one turn up on a York-Liverpool train through Manchester Victoria. This info is from the first shed allocation in 58-59, if you have a specific year then I might be able to get a hold of the relevant ABC and double check for you.

Really helpful, and reassuring to know that it's not a mix of different builds. My period is late 50s/early 60s, so an as-built condition, no yellow panel, smooth water tanks, no name D228, a Longsight loco fits the bill admirably.

For the record, small yellow ends started to come in around 1963 so if that falls in your time line then you could do that. Note also that D324 didn't enter service until June 61 so dates may or may not be important.

Regarding what you need, well first off you need vertical bars in the cab windows the partition off the quarterlights, then your going to need to add a diagonal brace to the radiator intake (large grill on the side) and then you will need to add a frost grill over the top, you can still see the brace through the frost grill so may as well add it first. Locos in later years had the frost grill removed but I believe the LMR always fitted them, even to locos that had lost them from other divisions and were transferred to the LMR.

You'll also need a water tank, that's the tank between the bogies, fuel tank is in the main body, you'll also need eight small air tanks in this area as well, two lots of two each side and located about the end of each tank. One other factor with water tanks is age and loco dependent, the first 100 were built smooth sided, after that they had re-enforcing bars welded to the outside, the first 100 were retro fitted starting around 62 but some were still smooth sided in late 63. The rest are small details like tank fillers and hoses under the body side, I'd have to look in the JLTRT kit to see what they have included.

Thankyou. It helps to know what else is needed, and I can start thinking about how I shall approach the various items. I don't know what I'm going to be able to get out of JLTRT, and until I do, there's no point in starting any detailing work.

I measured the JLTRT buffer beam heigh above the side frames, it's 1.45 mm so my initial visual guess wasn't too far out, I've ammended my etch accordingly as well as adjusting some other parts for easier construction on V.02.

Thanks. I think I will be able to file mine down rather than remove it. I shall have to replace the buffer pads anyway - thay may well come with whichever buffers I source.

Hope that helps.
Click to expand...

It does help a great deal, thank you.

Richard
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
Overseer said:
Very impressive scratch building. The subtlety of the angles and curves, along with the grilles and window surounds, really add up to a very convincing model. It looks like it will be well worth completing. I would be worried about the fragility of the bogies if it is to be a working model - from experience with aged thin styrene sheet, one derailment and the side frames will shatter or at best lose chunks.

Definitely one to watch.
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You're right. I'm definitely worried about the fragility of the bogies, and some of the thin bits on the body side. I'm considering Aralditing some brass to the inside of the plastic frame to provide strength. In addition, I don't fancy hanging a heavy parcels train off those buffer beams as they stand. But by the same token I don't want a glass case model. It has to work for its living.

Richard
 
mickoo

mickoo

Western Thunderer
Richard, D228 would be good, it went new to Longsight in Aug 59 and was withdrawn from Longsight in Oct 84 though I do not think she stayed there her whole life, some locos did though.

She was named at Crewe works in Sept 62 and infuriatingly I do not have a digital picture of D228 at all, though I'm confident that in all the books I have there will be one I can scan for you, probably won't be any different from any other class 40 of that period but I always feel it's nice to have at least one photo of the loco your modelling.
 
dibateg

dibateg

Western Thunderer
There is something in owning and completing a model that was started by those that have passed on. A couple of my LMS coaches came from Barry Rackstraw and I completed his build. They will always remind me of Barry, and I hope he would be pleased with the finished result and the pleasure they have brought to me and others.

I'm looking forward to good progress on this 40 Richard!!

Best Regards

Tony
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
Hi

All hail Saint Laurie of Irvine. I am blessed as he sent me everything I asked for.I think I pushed my luck though!

P1010079a.jpg

I now have a really good chance of making a fist of the 40, though I don't think I can start until I get my hands on the ABC power units, as I prefer to build from the bottom up. So sometime after the Reading show all being well.

In the meantime, does anyone have a set of redundant JLTRT 40 instructions I can have/borrow, or that they can scan for me to assist in the location of the various components?

Thanks very much.

Richard
 
Ressaldar

Ressaldar

Western Thunderer
Dikitriki said:
In the meantime, does anyone have a set of redundant JLTRT 40 instructions I can have/borrow, or that they can scan for me to assist in the location of the various components?Thanks very much.

Richard
Click to expand...

Hi Richard,

in the post today

cheers

Mike
 
Ressaldar

Ressaldar

Western Thunderer
Hi Richard,

on second thoughts, are you or any member of Heyside coming to Gresford on Sunday, the folder can be picked up from the Bring & Buy stand.

cheers

Mike
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
Hi Mike

I'm not available I'm afraid, I don't know whether Tony is. I'll happily refund postage though.

Cheers

Richard
 
Ressaldar

Ressaldar

Western Thunderer
Hi Richard,

I will post the entire contents of my folder, that way I'll not keep the most important piece of paper

cheers

Mike
 
Dikitriki

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
Hi Mike

Folder just received - many thanks indeed.

What sort of radius curves does a JLTRT 40 go round comfortably?

Coincidentally, I have a DJH 40 to refurb - that one is far too heavy for comfort.

Huge and very imposing beasties aren't they?

Richard
 
Ressaldar

Ressaldar

Western Thunderer
Hi Richard,

the pony truck dictates that the smallest radius is 6' 6" I had a great time getting things sorted. Getting the pony truck right was the key.

Cheers

Mike
 
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