Prototype Barry 1967 and 1968

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Dave - very valid comments. It seems that the whim of the loco owner comes first and historical accuracy a long way behind. However we have to remember that without the owners we wouldn't have the locos at all, and in some cases the extraneous bits and pieces, like injectors, may not be available to the original pattern. Bodywork changes are, however, a different matter. That's why the hiving off of the T3 from the National Collection is so unfortunate. It was, after all, in original condition.

As for 44123, Paul, the presence of the cab off the loco is perhaps a fair indication that overhaul is continuing but it seems mighty slow for a loco which has already been running.

For today lots of one 2-8-0 and a Pacific too, which is a pretty good clue......

53809 was the second of the S & D 2-8-0s at Barry. It was withdrawn from Bath Green Park at the beginning of June 1964. It landed up in Barry in August 1964 and left in December 1975 to go to the Midland Railway Centre where it first entered service in February 2006. It's now operational on the North Norfolk Railway.

53809.  Barry Scrapyard.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL (2).jpg53809.  Barry Scrapyard.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL.jpg53809.  Barry.  18 Nov 1967.  copyright FINAL.  Photo by Brian Dale. (2).jpg53809.  Barry.  18 Nov 1967.  copyright FINAL.  Photo by Brian Dale.jpg53809.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

Next is the "impossible" restoration. I personally had no doubt that Duke of Gloucester was a lost cause, but as we know it came back to life after a long restoration at Loughborough. It's performance on the main line since then has been an absolute eye opener but the story is well documented elsewhere so I'll just cover the bare bones here. It was withdrawn from Crewe North in November 1962. It arrived at Barry in October 1967 via Cashmore's - a story in itself. It left Barry in April 1974. In 1986 it made its first run in preservation. At the moment it's undergoing overhaul at Tyseley. At the time of my photo the loco still had its original tender which was later sold to a steelworks as an ingot carrier. When purchased a 9F tender was bought to go with the loco.

71000.  SECOND SHOT.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

71000.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

Brian
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
It seems that the whim of the loco owner comes first and historical accuracy a long way behind.
Speaking as one time owner of a double deck bus, I had just completely repainted it in its original 1952 livery when a visitor asked me why I hadn't done it in SELNEC bright orange livery, which it never carried and which I considered was an abortion that had obliterated many once proud civic-pride liveries around the Manchester area. My colleagues stood in silence for a moment to listen to my response and were not disappointed.

By and large though, I agree that when a person or persons have spent a great deal of money on restoring a hulk into a working piece of machinery, it is up to them how they paint it. It's simple when you look at it logically....."I'm gonna buy a scrap locomotive and do what I want with it. It doesn't belong to the nation".
 
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Dave Holt

Western Thunderer
When you look at the state of DoG in those photos, it seems almost beyond belief that anyone thought it could be restored to working order. OK, other projects have had new wheels, coupling and connecting rods and various other bits made from scratch - but that's all fairly basic forging, casting and machining work. DoG not only required new cylinders - a complex enough job in itself -but to re-create the complexities of the Caprotti cam boxes and their working innards, more akin to automotive or aircraft technology than traditional steam loco work, is just a mind blowing achievement. Thank goodness a group of people believed it was possible and pursued their dreams to a very successful conclusion. I, for one, am very much looking forward to seeing it back out on the main line in the not too distant future.
Dave.
 

Scanlon

Western Thunderer
The pictures of 71000 reminded me of another memory from way back in 1965, when I visited the yard for the first time. 71000 and the others are on what was the "delivery road" for the main yard and are alongside a huge goods shed, now long gone. On my first visit this road had a number of locos which had just been delivered which included a a Jinty and a Hughes Fowler Crab. Goodness knows which ones but they have been saved for posterity.
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Larry - your comments are so correct. At the end of the day the item has been saved for posterity and the paint job is one which can be corrected.

Dave - Although my major drive at the time was fund raising to purchase the GCR I also did a bit of publicity for DoG. In view of the interest here may I direct you to 8P 71000 4-6-2 BR Standard Duke of Gloucester which gives a pretty good background. It may not be absolutely accurate - equally it may! - but gives some sense of the mountain the DoG chaps climbed.

As for 71000 on the arrival road, Roger, I can tell you exactly what the accompanying locos were, and give some sense of the shed behind. (Actually 71000 didn't arrive at Barry until a month before this set of photos which were in November 1967 so your memory of 1965 may make you a couple of years older than you look.:D) The Crab was 42765 - see my post #118 - and the Jinty was 47357 - my post #153. There was also a Standard 4, 75014, in the same queue, the photo of which has yet to appear.

Brian
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Withdrawn from Guildford in June 1966 this is 73082, the erstwhile Camelot. The position of the nameplate can easily be determined. It moved to Barry in November 1966 and then the Bluebell Railway in October 1979 where, after restoration and the building of new tender bodywork and tank on an old frame it entered service in October 1995. After further overhauls it's currently operational on the Bluebell.

73082.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

This is the Standard 4 4-6-0 referred to previously alongside the large shed at Barry. It's 75014 (71000 is behind) which was withdrawn from Shrewsbury at the end of 1966. It arrived at Barry in October 1967, about a month before my visit. It was initially based on the NYMR from February 1981 where it steamed again in 1994. It is currently operational on the Dartmouth Steam Railway.

75014.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

and another of the same class. 75069 was withdrawn from Eastleigh in September 1966. It arrived at Barry in May 1967 and left for preservation at the SVR where it arrived in July 1974. It was operational in 1984. It's been overhauled again and is operational on the SVR.

75069.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL.  Photo by Brian Dale.jpg

Brian
 

LarryG

Western Thunderer
Back in 1977, I drove over to Keighley to see their BR Std 4 4-6-0 as well as try out a new camera. There was something about the neatly restored loco that didn't look right (to my eyes) and it wasn't until the film was processed back home that I realised it was the large Tender. I had only ever seen these engines with the small tenders in steam days, but of course they were normal fare daan saath.
 

Yorkshire Dave

Western Thunderer
Back in 1977, I drove over to Keighley to see their BR Std 4 4-6-0 as well as try out a new camera. There was something about the neatly restored loco that didn't look right (to my eyes) and it wasn't until the film was processed back home that I realised it was the large Tender. I had only ever seen these engines with the small tenders in steam days, but of course they were normal fare daan saath.

I believe the Southern Region standard 4s & 5s had the larger tenders as they did not have water troughs - mainly due to the electrified lines and the non-stopping distances traversed were not as lengthy as other regions. There was a mandatory stop at Salisbury for the West of England services where water was taken on.
 

AJC

Western Thunderer
I believe the Southern Region standard 4s & 5s had the larger tenders as they did not have water troughs - mainly due to the electrified lines and the non-stopping distances traversed were not as lengthy as other regions. There was a mandatory stop at Salisbury for the West of England services where water was taken on.

And not all the Standard 4s did have the larger tenders (ok, so some of the 4-6-0s transferred in had BR2 tenders) but the 2-6-0s mostly had the smaller tenders on the Southern.

Adam
 

Kier Hardy

Active Member
I'm enjoying this thread and in particular the history behind some of the locomotives and their subsequent restoration. It brings back very fond memories during 1972 when my dad and me took a special excursion to Cardiff from Paddington, travelling both ways in a first class mark 2 (2+1 seating with reclining seats!). Not wishing to hijack the thread, here are some pics taken that day of me aged 12.
barry_scrapyard-1972-03.jpg

barry_scrapyard-1972-01.jpg
barry_scrapyard-1972-02.jpg
Looking forward to the next installment.

ATB Kier.
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Thanks, all, for the additional stuff. Although I never studied the different standard loco tender types on the Southern I was aware of the differences and why they occurred.

Lovely red Class 2 there, Paul. Reminds me of the red 8F on the GCR. Long changed to black. However it is certainly the owner's prerogative and your non-enthusiast punter likes to see some lovely colours (!) or so I'm told.

That aircraft tug is an interesting project, Tony. Keep us up to date with progress. As we're talking about liveries will it be in the Ruskin livery?

Kier - what stood out for me in those photos was the one of you in the cab of D601. On my second visit I took one photo of the two NBL Warships to use the film up! Wish I'd taken more. They just missed the preservation band wagon - I suspect the thought at the time was that they would just be too technically challenging to restore and maintain.

On to the subjects for today, both Standard 4 4-6-0s and both the double chimney version with large tender..

First is 75078. This was withdrawn from Eastleigh in July 1966. It arrived at Barry in the following November and left in June 1972 to go to the KWVR. It steamed again in 1977. It's currently operational on the KWVR.

75078.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

This is 75079. It was withdrawn from Eastleigh in November 1966 arriving at Barry in April 1967. It was bought in 1982 for the Plym Valley Railway. In 2007 it was bought by the Mid Hants Railway where it is currently under restoration.

Note the Southern banana van behind endorsed "COND" rather than the roughly painted circular motif which I remember.

75079.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

Brian
 
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oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Now to two of the BR standard class 2 2-6-0s.

78018 was withdrawn from Shrewsbury in November 1966 arriving at Barry in June 1967 with 78019. In October 1978 it moved to the Battlefield Line at Market Bosworth. It's now at the GCR by way of Darlington, steamed in August 2016 and is now operational.

78018.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL.  Photo by Brian Dale.jpg

This is 78059 which was withdrawn from Crewe South in November 1966 and arrived at Barry in June 1967. It was purchased for the Bluebell in May 1983 as the donor engine for the new build 2MT tank 84030 the building of which is ongoing.

78059.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL.  Photo by Brian Dale.jpg

Brian
 

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Osgood

Western Thunderer
Yes Brian, it is a ww2 era aircraft (or perhaps baggage trolley) tug.
Reason for choice of livery being (unlike the locos in Barry) its history is unknown and likely to remain so, I have no affinity to any real airline, and feel it would be dull in just another plain colour.
So spurred on by the discussion above (I always felt that Lakeside 2-6-4 looked pretty dapper wearing Caledonian livery), I thought the fictional Ruskin livery, being vaguely similar to its current paint job, might transfer quite well and could not possibly offend anyone (famous last words).

It was originally intended as spares for a wartime USAAF tug but not now needed, and having found an engine and radiator for it there is now no reason not to bring it back to life (a bit like some of the locos in Barry!). :)

Although thinking about it - I could work up a LNER livery scheme. Whistle.gif
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
On to the Standard 2-6-4 tanks. I always thought these smart engines whilst still preferring the proportions of the Fairburns and the shear brute bulk of the Fowlers.

To start, 80135 with 80079 ahead. 80135 was withdrawn from Shrewsbury in July 1965. It went to Barry in January 1966 and in April 1973 went to the NYMR. It first steamed in 1980 and is probably being overhauled again but may be back in service by now.

80135.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

80151 was an Eastleigh engine and was withdrawn in May 1967 arriving at Barry in October 1967. In May 1975 it moved to the East Anglian Railway Museum before going to the Bluebell Railway where it first steamed in preservation in 2001. It is currently operational.

80151.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

Brian
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
.....and with one bound we are on to the 9Fs.

92085 was retired from Birkenhead Mollington Street at the end of December 1966. This was one of only two unfortunates from Barry which were actually scrapped. Apparently the supply of wagons dried up and 92085 and 4156 were scrapped at Barry in July 1980.

92085.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL - Copy.jpg

92134 was more fortunate. It was also a December 1966 withdrawal from Birkenhead arriving at Barry in June 1967. It left Barry in December 1980 to the NYMR. By a circuitous route changing ownership along the way it steamed again in 2019 and is currently operational on the NYMR.

92134.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

92207 was withdrawn from Ebbw Junction Newport in December 1964 and arrived at Barry in March 1965. It left Barry for the ELR in October 1986. I understand that it's currently at a private site in Poole where restoration is in hand. Such a shame it had to wait so long before it was pulled out of the yard. Apart from the injector on this side the loco looks complete. I wonder if it hauled itself and some other unfortunates to the yard.

92207.  Barry.  18 November 1967.  Photo by Brian Dale.  copyright FINAL.jpg

Finally, to wrap up the 1967 photos here are a couple of gratuitous shots giving some idea of the extent of the scrapyard.

Barry Scrapyard.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL (2).jpg

Barry Scrapyard.  18 November 1967.  copyright FINAL.jpg

In the next installment we'll have the first photos from 1968.

Brian
 
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