Photo Everything Cranes

Discussion in 'Resources' started by BrushType4, 15 November 2012.

  1. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

    I've got some Parkside Ex Blue Spot wagons laying around waiting to be painted and the picture below caught my eye.

    Can anyone help me identify the crane and coach please or point me in the right direction?

  2. Dog Star

    Dog Star Western Thunderer

    Try the Breakdown Crane Association... or wait until the owner of GWR No.2 happens by ('cos he is a WT member).
  3. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    Gimme a few moments...

    What I can say from the outset is that it's a Cowans Sheldon crane and probably quite an early one as it hasn't got Stokes bogies. The jib runner is interesting being 6-wheeled so I imagine an ID wouldn't be too tricky.

    The support coach looks to be an ex-LMS 57' BG to me, but I may not have that completely correct.

    I'll have a 'dig' and see if I can get more detail on the crane for you...

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  4. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

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  5. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

    Steph, was the runner specifically built or is it a cut down wagon?
  6. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    Goodness only knows....!

    I'm not convinced the crane isn't RS1076/30 as the details in your photo link match those in my photo link quite well. The only problem with that, is that by implication the details in the Brownlie book are wrong; the full caption to the BDCA gallery photo reads "A 5-axle 30-ton crane built in 1943, transferred from Llanduno Jnc to Shrewsbury in 1944, to the Western Region from 1948-1963, then to Crewe and in 1968 to Rugby. Withdrawn 1969. (From John S Brownlie's "Railway Steam Cranes")".

    As the Brownlie book is a pretty turgid read, I'm not inclined to wade through it in the hope of coming across the pertinent info. But I'll have a skim through the Tatlow book and see what turns up. Right - did that , no joy; you're going to have to wait for volume 2 to be published next year!

    It'd help if I could read any of the text on the crane - even the jib 'TO LIFT ** TONS' would be a start as most publications group cranes by their lifting capability.

    Incidentally, if you're into modelling this crane there is a kit for a representative 5-axle 36t Cowans Sheldon. It was produced by DJB in LSWR form with the whacky jib runners built from old tender underframes. It's from way back when and is now a (pricey) rarity. If you come across one I'd happily cross your palm with silver for the jib runners; for my model of the Eastleigh crane (Sanspareil kit for the Ransomes & Rapier)!

  7. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

    I think it says 30 tonnes and was based at March?
  8. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    Can't help with a March allocated one, but it would appear that there were 6 30tonners (of which RS1076/30 was one) which were delivered at the same time and had 6-wheel runners.

    More info (and a picture) here: The fourth post down says:
    "Drawings & details of LMS 30T Cowans, Sheldon & Co. Steam Crane appeared in October 1972 edition of Model Railways... Peter Tatlow.

    Numbers for the LMS type:

    RS 1066/30 + Match 770011
    RS 1072/30 + Match 770006
    RS 1073/30 + Match 770010
    RS 1074/30 + Match 770007
    RS 1075/30 + Match 770009
    RS 1076/30 + Match 770008"

    And a useful pic here:

    I've had a thought about your question on the jib runner - I have a suspicion they were probably purpose built as I can't imagine there were many steel-underframed 6-wheel vehicles being withdrawn even in the mid '40s) to provide secondhand underframes.

    That should be enough to get you well and truly moving on what would be a very interesting modelling project!

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  9. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

  10. lancer1027

    lancer1027 Western Thunderer

    Mmmmm that reminds me i must get back onto my crane build.

    Although i need to get some close up detail pics. Trouble is the actual crane for Laira is the one at Bream. :headbang:

    A long way to go for photos at this time of year .:(
  11. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    I might have that set of drawings, was skiming through my pile of drawings 'extracted' from old mags to save space and weight and came across a set for a crane and thought interesting project and placed them to one side, I will check tonight and see which one it is for y'all.

    I'd prefer a more modern crane or larger (Willesden or LMR 75T?) but getting drawings is quite difficult as I'm sure you all know.

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  12. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    No, I haven't. I'm pretty fortunate in that the two cranes I'm modelling were pretty well documented!

    Yep - I was wondering where you'd got to. D'you mean the crane at the Flour Mill? I'm sure they'd make you very welcome... Or, is there not another similar one preserved somewhere else?

    Mick, I think there were some published in an old Modellers Backtrack. I'll see what I can dig out when I'm next at my folks, my Dad's got a full set. On reflection I need to see if these apply to Lancer's chosen crane too.

    Phil (again),

    Anyway, back to the LMS 30-tonners we're discussing. I did end up fighting my way through Brownlie's near-interminable English and dug out the following:

    There were six cranes in this series, as described earlier in the thread. The first was a prototype and this crane (at least) ran originally with a bogie bolster-style runner (there's a pic in the book), rather than the three-axle type in the photos we have in this thread. As an aside it appears that the equivalent Ransomes and Rapier 30 tonners (1067/30 - 1071/30) also had three-axle runners.

    I can't specifically find a reference to one of the CS cranes at March, but the Brownlie book was published in '72, so doesn't cover the date of your picture for a start. However, two of the CS cranes were already allocated to the Eastern region by then; 1072/30 (which went to Lincoln in '54) and 1075/30 (which went to Shirebrook in '68). Of the others, 1076/30 had been withdrawn (in '69) and 1066, 1073, 1074 remained in service on the LM region.

    So, it's quite likely to be one of the cranes of this batch. As indicated above, drawings can be found and we should be able to determine which crane it is exactly when volume 2 of Tatlow comes out next year.

    Now you've got no excuse for not joining a very exclusive club...!

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  13. Dog Star

    Dog Star Western Thunderer

    Well that counts me out then... Graham (Groucho) Marx

    Noting that this is not an in-joke.... you have not lived without a healthy dose of Marxism of the "Brothers" sort.
  14. lancer1027

    lancer1027 Western Thunderer

    Hi Steph, yes it is the one at the flour mill but there is one at the Great Central which is the same i think:thumbs:
    I will have to get the volume 2 copy of the cranes if the 45 ton Ransome & Rapier steam crane is in it:thumbs:

    Rob. :)
  15. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer


    Thanks, my father is just going through a collection of mags bought at car boot, of which quite a few are Modellers Backtrack so I may get lucky, if not I'd like to see what you can come up with, I didn't see any cranes when I skimmed through to baggsi what was left LoL but it was a very quick skim.


    Ok back to the subject in hand, the drawings I have are LMS 36/50T cranes from Cowans, stock numbers are ADRC95202-204 and are in the March 2004 British Railway Modelling so that's another source of drawings not noted by the other sources.

    I need to scan them in and add to my digitized drawing collection, y'all welcome to a 'preview', by PM please, to see if they are what you need and go hunting for the mag :).

  16. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

    Excellent pictures and plans. Not the crane I was looking for, but I wonder if will do as very similar.
  17. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer


    I just thought I'd draw your attention to this page on the BDCR website, which details crane-related reading materials. From about half way down the page it lists magazines content and, where applicable, drawings. I think you may find that there are things there for all the respondents to this thread...!

    I wish I'd found it a bit earlier, which is silly really when I'm a member of the BDCA...

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  18. lancer1027

    lancer1027 Western Thunderer


    Just been looking on the BDCA site and noticed in the gallery someone has built a model of a 45 ton R & R steam crane. Do you have any more info on this.?

  19. BrushType4

    BrushType4 Western Thunderer

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  20. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    So what was that you were saying about blue spot wagons today? Me thinks a change in tack coming across the horizon shortly! LOL. Of the two options, this'd be the one I'd go for....but then I'm biased LOL.