GWR automatic train control gear

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
Coming soon to my workbench is a JLTRT 57xx pannier tank, and my researches lead me to believe the loco would have been fitted with the GWR ATC gear from new (around 1930).

Further research tells me Slater's have such an animal in their stock of detailing parts (M7024 GWR Automatic Train Control Gear). I can't quite fathom why Slater's haven't got round to slapping things on a scanner and uploading images so we can see the goods, but it's very frustrating.

Does anyone have an image of this component I can take a look at, please?
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Heather,

GWR Frame plan for 5700 class, dated 1930, does not show any ATC gear.

We have a Slater's kit for a GWR Saint here, I shall ask Peter to see what castings are supplied in the box. Are you asking about specifically a Slater's casting for if not I can see what is in a JLTRT SDK for a GWR Star.

regards, Graham
 

Steph Dale

Western Thunderer
Heather,

I ran into this problem with my 2251, which still has no ATC shoe fitted. There are apparently two types of shoe and the type which mounts on the leading axle hornblocks seems to still be conspicuous by its absence.

Graham and I were discussing it here, but didn't seem to draw any useful conclusions.

Steph
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
Heather, I would suggest perusing a copy of 'Pannier Papers No.2 - The 57xx Engines: 36xx, 37xx, 46xx' would be helpful. It states "The Automatic Train Control equipment was first fitted to 5790-5799, the last of Lot no. 260 built late 1929/early 1930. The remainder (5700-5789) got the equipment as they passed through the works."
The book also details variations in many other items from boilers to fittings such as steam heating, brakes etc.
Cheers
Dave
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
Ooh, Dave, that's very useful. The question then arises of when the chosen loco may have arrived in the works after building. The time period for the model is pre-1934, so I can surmise the loco may not have been through the works and been retrofitted.

My source for the information is the RCTS "Locomotives of the Great Western Railway" Part 5, which implies all the locos built outside Swindon were fitted with the ATC gear on delivery.

If I'm honest, I don't suppose the client will notice it's not there, and neither would many people I suspect. :oops:
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
Graham, I asked after Slater's because so far they are the only supplier who seem to provide the gear as an accessory part. I can't tell from JLTRT whether ATC shoes are in their SDKs. I suppose I could call Laurie and ask.

For the record, the chosen loco is 7752, built by NBL in 193o to lot 274. This number was chosen purely because the MRJ "Ubiquitous '57s" article by Ian Rice has lots of detail shots of that particular loco! :drool:
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
Ooh, Dave, that's very useful. The question then arises of when the chosen loco may have arrived in the works after building. The time period for the model is pre-1934, so I can surmise the loco may not have been through the works and been retrofitted.

My source for the information is the RCTS "Locomotives of the Great Western Railway" Part 5, which implies all the locos built outside Swindon were fitted with the ATC gear on delivery.
I should have kept typing! The paragraph continues "Engines built by outside contractors, 7750-7799 and 8700-8749, were fitted with the gear when they arrived at Swindon (my italics) with 7700-7749 getting it in subsequent years."
Were they all delivered directly from contractors to Swindon for acceptance or did they go directly to their allocated sheds?
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Were they all delivered directly from contractors to Swindon for acceptance or did they go directly to their allocated sheds?
I have no idea. :oops:
My understanding, from reading the tender documents for the 9400 class, is that the engines were dispatched to Swindon for inspection even though I believe that the GWR Inspector at the supplier's premises would not have permitted the engines to be dispatched if not acceptable. When ready for traffic SW (Swindon Works) would attach a label to the cab handrail and then get the loco moved to either SS (Swindon Stockshed) or SN (Swindon Running Shed) for subsequent movement to the allocated depot.

If desirable I can look up the relevant Engine Allocation registers and see what appears as the first entry for the contractor locos.
 

Tim V

Western Thunderer
The apparatus under the rear bunker is very visible, but the ones fitted under the front axle virtually invisible.

7752 is of course preserved, so not a "good" example to copy. Preservation does not always equal "as built".
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
7752 is of course preserved, so not a "good" example to copy. Preservation does not always equal "as built".


Good point, well made.

I have agreed with the client what will be built. I will be honest and say he doesn't really mind what the loco ends up as provided it can be identified as a 5700 class pannier tank.

Graham, thanks for those links. :thumbs: I'll follow up, as well as see if I can find clear photos of the gear fitted to a pannier class loco.
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Graham and I were discussing it here...
Steph, whilst I can use your link to refresh my brain with our discussion of January 2011 (really that long ago?) I cannot open the images on page 1 of the topic. Reading the text suggests that being able to see the pictures is going to benefit Heather - please try to fix the thumbnail links or post the images here.

Thanks, Graham
 

Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Heather,

If you are creating a representation of engine no. 7752 then the model is going to need the ATC control box in the cab and the ATC pick-up gear under the bunker - castings for those parts are available from Hobbyhorse Developments (Reynalds range). The ATC control box is mounted on the right hand cab side-sheet, above the reverser, look for four bolts arranged in a square and visible on the outside of the same side-sheet. In addition you will need to include the battery box which is mounted under the right-hand hanging bar and to the rear of the cab footstep.... plus any visible electrical conduits.

For added authenticity, polish the under side of the pick-up shoe to represent where the shoe runs along the ATC ramp.

regards, Graham
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
Thanks Graham

I'll get on to Simon at Hobbyhorse and acquire the bits. Many, many thanks to everyone for their input with this. It's very much appreciated. :thumbs:
 
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