Prototype GWR Toad Guards Vans

Rob Pulham

Rob Pulham

Western Thunderer
Nice to see that a good few of them made it to preservation Dave. :thumbs: Not my area of interest but the very first brass kit I built was a 4mm scale toad - one of Jim McGeown's last 4mm kits. I thought it was cheap enough to practice on and it didn't turn out too shabby in the end.
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Hi Rob,
Are you the same Rob from the gog forum?
Having just checked on the gog forum and if you are the same person I see you are an LNER man, so I'll see what photos I can find you.

Dave.
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Hi All

Another Toad with when built information. This was built to Dia. AA23 and Lot 1497 between 1945 and 1948.

There were 66 built to this Lot No. This photo was taken on the LLangollen Railway in 2010.

ToadVans10.JPG
 
Osgood

Osgood

Western Thunderer
Here is what I believe to have been an ex Severn Tunnel van (enclosed end with port holes?) which I went to inspect at Cottesmore in 2005. Why I didn't end up buying it I'll never know :rolleyes::headbang: - would have made a great spare bedroom if not an enclosure for a GW branchline terminus.

I wonder where it ended up?

Toad 3 2005.jpgToad 2 2005.jpgToad 1 2005.jpg
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Osgood said:
Here is what I believe to have been an ex Severn Tunnel van (enclosed end with port holes?) which I went to inspect at Cottesmore in 2005. Why I didn't end up buying it I'll never know :rolleyes::headbang: - would have made a great spare bedroom if not an enclosure for a GW branchline terminus.

I wonder where it ended up?

View attachment 26018View attachment 26019View attachment 26020
Click to expand...

Hi Osgood

Was this from the then Rutland Iron Ore Museum now called 'Rocks by Rail'. If so it is no longer there as I was there yesterday on a Photo Charter. (18/11/13)

This Toad would not have been used in the actual tunnel. These had their veranda's boxed in and the stable door was replaced with a full sized door. I have an Allocation list for Toad vans and this one's number 1795? is not listed to the Severn Tunnel Junction. Did you happen to get the running number from the other side? I also could not find one photo with a veranda end plated in with port holes fitted and I have a lot of info on Toad vans.

Dave
 
Osgood

Osgood

Western Thunderer
Dave Bowden said:
Hi Osgood

Was this from the then Rutland Iron Ore Museum now called 'Rocks by Rail'. If so it is no longer there as I was there yesterday on a Photo Charter. (18/11/13)

This Toad would not have been used in the actual tunnel. These had their veranda's boxed in and the stable door was replaced with a full sized door. I have an Allocation list for Toad vans and this one's number 1795? is not listed to the Severn Tunnel Junction. Did you happen to get the running number from the other side? I also could not find one photo with a veranda end plated in with port holes fitted and I have a lot of info on Toad vans.

Dave
Click to expand...

Dave - I guess it would have left the site not too long after I looked at it in 2005 - I believe it was owned privately and was being offered for sale ex Cottesmore sidings. I'm sure it had gone by 2006. I was told the portholes identified it as a Severn Tunnel van - I wonder if the verandah might have been opened up at some point? Sorry I didn't get any pics of the other side. If it is a puzzle that needs to be solved, I reckon Simon Layfield at Rocks By Rail would be able to help.

Tony
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Osgood said:
Dave - I guess it would have left the site not too long after I looked at it in 2005 - I believe it was owned privately and was being offered for sale ex Cottesmore sidings. I'm sure it had gone by 2006. I was told the portholes identified it as a Severn Tunnel van - I wonder if the verandah might have been opened up at some point? Sorry I didn't get any pics of the other side. If it is a puzzle that needs to be solved, I reckon Simon Layfield at Rocks By Rail would be able to help.

Tony
Click to expand...
I've spoken to Peter Layfield, Simon's father. He told me it had come from the Oxfordshire Ironstone Co. of which it was one of three. He is going to get back to me with info if he can find some on the Toad they had. He also added the Toad had been bought by someone in Oswestry but has since died.

I have found during research that Toad 68642 AA15 of 1923 currently at Quainton Road went from BR to the OIC. and became their no.3 and was used at Banbury until 1970.

I'll add more as info. as it become available.

Dave
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Having found a list on the UKsteam Info site of all GWR wagons & toad vans it shows W17952 as being at the Rutland Rly Museum This was built to Lot No.888 in 1921-2 to Dia. AA15 not an AA13 as in the GWR E-list Group.

This is also confirmed from the GWR Goods Wagons book (Atkins/Beard & Tourret) and John Lewis's article 'The Common Toad' Part 5 (Scale Trains)

Dave
 
Osgood

Osgood

Western Thunderer
Dave Bowden said:
I've spoken to Peter Layfield, Simon's father. He told me it had come from the Oxfordshire Ironstone Co. of which it was one of three. He is going to get back to me with info if he can find some on the Toad they had. He also added the Toad had been bought by someone in Oswestry but has since died.

I have found during research that Toad 68642 AA15 of 1923 currently at Quainton Road went from BR to the OIC. and became their no.3 and was used at Banbury until 1970.

I'll add more as info. become available.

Dave
Click to expand...

Oh......shucks :rolleyes:- if I'd known at the time it was an ex O.I. van I would probably have adopted it back in 2005, despite it requiring a significant amount of metal panel repair. The ironstone quarrying connection would have influenced me heavily! If you find out its whereabouts and it is wanting a home I'd certainly still be interested! :thumbs:

Tony
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Hi Osgood

I have some further information having spoken to Peter Layfield again. The person who bought 17952 Toad may not have died, just was very ill so for the moment I take back my statement that he died.

Peter told me the person was involved with the Oswestry heritage group and owned a GWR hall. Having looked at the Cambrian Heritage Railway (based in Oswestry) this morning I found 19752 in their wagons list!

Peter also told me they had spent a lot of money on restoring it to it's original state and was unlikely they would part with it. On their website there is a phone number if you still wish to contact someone there.

Dave
 
Osgood

Osgood

Western Thunderer
Thanks Dave - sounds like it is in a good place, that's the main thing. It certainly needed a lot of work - which is what I think put me off back then. But these opportunities don't come up too often.

Would it be reasonable to believe that Oxfordshire Ironstone added the steel end plate with portholes (maybe window frames off an old industrial) to make life more comfortable for the guard when running with van leading?
Tony
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Osgood said:
Thanks Dave - sounds like it is in a good place, that's the main thing. It certainly needed a lot of work - which is what I think put me off back then. But these opportunities don't come up too often.

Would it be reasonable to believe that Oxfordshire Ironstone added the steel end plate with portholes (maybe window frames off an old industrial) to make life more comfortable for the guard when running with van leading?
Tony
Click to expand...
Hi Tony

Peter Layfied did say that the OIC had fitted the end plate with the port holes in it so I think it is a reasonable to assume that's why it was fitted.
I've tried looking for rolling stock photos from the OIC but to no avail yet.
They had three and we had identified two so far, maybe I might get lucky with the third.

Dave
 
Dave Bowden

Dave Bowden

Western Thunderer
Dave Bowden said:
Hi Phill

I'll see what I can find out for you by asking members on the GWSG of which I'm a member.
Do you know the location in the photo of the Toad van?

Dave
Click to expand...
Phill can you email me the photo please. The address is in my account/contact details.
I wish to have someone look at it.
Dave
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
What's New?
Top