7mm Hattons Gresley Coach

[John Ross]

As I have a stock of unbuilt kits, I thought I would further dip my toe into the O Gauge RTR stock by purchasing Hattons Gresley coaches.



Was a little bit miffed that living in the North of Scotland, but by no means remote having to pay £14-00 for delivery rather than the free option offered to everyone else.

As for the coaches themselves they come package in good supporting box. When unpacked a quick run over with the scale rule and they seem to measure up close to scale.

Quality wise the body work seems reasonable, flush glazed and separate metal coach handles. Only downside there is no obvious way to gain entry to the inside so vehicles will have to run without passengers.

Underframe is a bit of a disappointment. The footboards on the bogies are plastic held in place with two pins that were found to be broken off on delivery. A phone call to Hattons saw the faulty items uplifted (it took a week to travel back to Liverpool and two days for replacement to return). Sadly this one suffered the same fault plus metal footsteps on body were bent. Hattons offered another replacement and when their representative confirmed that they had had a lot of issues with this problem I declined an exchange and will do a repair myself.



Bogies are detailed, but are made of plastic and remind me of something that you found under a 1970s Tri-ang coach rather than current O Gauge models. I bought some Ellis Clark bogies to fit under a BR Mk1 I am working on and the quality of the latter cannot be faulted. Back to the bogies under the Gresley coach there is also a lot of side play in the wheelsets. One of the reasons I took up Hattons offer of a replacement first time around was that the bogie side frame had become detached and the wheelset had dropped out of place. I notice from Ellis Clark’s website that the bogies that are going to be fitted to their Thompson coaches are to be offered as a spare. When available provide they are of metal manufacture I will purchase these to replace the ones on the Gresley coach as the added weight should improve running.




Couplings are represented with a non-working buckeye type and screw couplings that come as an added extra that again had bits missing. I not certain how these can be coupled and if they can it will not be easy. Kadee couplings as a replacement would seem a good alternative, but space between coach and bogie I think rules this out. Best option and the one I will go for is Magclic swing type.

All in all coach is little below present O Gauge standard, if you are interested in purchasing one or a few. Hatton’s offer 4 grades of coach considering the changes that need to be made I would suggest going for the “D” version as these have a minimum of 3 known faults and are on sale for £150 rather than the full price of £179.

 

[djparkins]

As I have a stock of unbuilt kits, I thought I would further dip my toe into the O Gauge RTR stock by purchasing Hattons Gresley coaches.

View attachment 139927

Was a little bit miffed that living in the North of Scotland, but by no means remote having to pay £14-00 for delivery rather than the free option offered to everyone else.

As for the coaches themselves they come package in good supporting box. When unpacked a quick run over with the scale rule and they seem to measure up close to scale.

Quality wise the body work seems reasonable, flush glazed and separate metal coach handles. Only downside there is no obvious way to gain entry to the inside so vehicles will have to run without passengers.

Underframe is a bit of a disappointment. The footboards on the bogies are plastic held in place with two pins that were found to be broken off on delivery. A phone call to Hattons saw the faulty items uplifted (it took a week to travel back to Liverpool and two days for replacement to return). Sadly this one suffered the same fault plus metal footsteps on body were bent. Hattons offered another replacement and when their representative confirmed that they had had a lot of issues with this problem I declined an exchange and will do a repair myself.

View attachment 139928

Bogies are detailed, but are made of plastic and remind me of something that you found under a 1970s Tri-ang coach rather than current O Gauge models. I bought some Ellis Clark bogies to fit under a BR Mk1 I am working on and the quality of the latter cannot be faulted. Back to the bogies under the Gresley coach there is also a lot of side play in the wheelsets. One of the reasons I took up Hattons offer of a replacement first time around was that the bogie side frame had become detached and the wheelset had dropped out of place. I notice from Ellis Clark’s website that the bogies that are going to be fitted to their Thompson coaches are to be offered as a spare. When available provide they are of metal manufacture I will purchase these to replace the ones on the Gresley coach as the added weight should improve running.

View attachment 139929


Couplings are represented with a non-working buckeye type and screw couplings that come as an added extra that again had bits missing. I not certain how these can be coupled and if they can it will not be easy. Kadee couplings as a replacement would seem a good alternative, but space between coach and bogie I think rules this out. Best option and the one I will go for is Magclic swing type.

All in all coach is little below present O Gauge standard, if you are interested in purchasing one or a few. Hatton’s offer 4 grades of coach considering the changes that need to be made I would suggest going for the “D” version as these have a minimum of 3 known faults and are on sale for £150 rather than the full price of £179.

Pleased l didn’t sell my Kemilway kits!

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Whilst being a quick fix for some the Hattons Gresley coach has personally some inaccuracies and build quality that I couldn't live with, I think I'd be inclined to get on and build a coach kit for the money.

Col.

 

[John Ross]

Whilst being a quick fix for some the Hattons Gresley coach has personally some inaccuracies and build quality that I couldn't live with, I think I'd be inclined to get on and build a coach kit for the money.

Col.

Agree a trap that I fell into because backlog of unbuilt kits and consider this a way of being closer to having a running railway. Seems a shame for a manufacturer to invest in a product line that would generate repeat business.

John

 

[LarryG]

I dont know what a kit for a Gresley coach would cost, but how many people can build and paint a kit to the same level as the Hattons Gresley coaches? They look like a snip to me and are worth a little extra effort if a modeller feels capable. A black gutter on the B&C coach for a start.

4mm modellers can only dream of a proper tumblehome on their rtr Gresleys .

 

[simond]

If you’ve ambitions for a railway that “runs trains”, you’ll logically need quite a few coaches. Building them from kits may be satisfying, but is time consuming, fiddly, repetitive, and not particularly cheap, building from scratch is likely cheaper, but requires much more effort, at least initially.

And anything other than the later, simpler liveries are beyond most mortals, at least those who haven’t been to the crossroads at midnight.

IMO there simply has to be a market for decent RTR coaches, particularly in 7mm, ideally “good enough”, so they stay on the track, look like the prototype, can be reliably coupled, are reasonably priced and can be further detailed by the buyer to suit his/her tastes.

I suspect the recent proliferation - Hattons, Dapol, Darstaedt, etc, suggests that the manufacturers think so too. Bring it on!

Simon

 

[djparkins]

If you’ve ambitions for a railway that “runs trains”, you’ll logically need quite a few coaches. Building them from kits may be satisfying, but is time consuming, fiddly, repetitive, and not particularly cheap, building from scratch is likely cheaper, but requires much more effort, at least initially.

And anything other than the later, simpler liveries are beyond most mortals, at least those who haven’t been to the crossroads at midnight.

IMO there simply has to be a market for decent RTR coaches, particularly in 7mm, ideally “good enough”, so they stay on the track, look like the prototype, can be reliably coupled, are reasonably priced and can be further detailed by the buyer to suit his/her tastes.

I suspect the recent proliferation - Hattons, Dapol, Darstaedt, etc, suggests that the manufacturers think so too. Bring it on!

Simon

Yes I see that totally. But if you only need 2-3 coaches and you are going to be looking at those over some years as they trundle into your branch terminus or whatever, and then sit there for two hours, then it might be a different matter.

I suppose it comes down to whether modelling is the journey, or a means to an end - i.e a layout. For me it’s just about the part I’m dealing with in that instant. Not some kind of race. Totally about being in the moment. It makes you think deeply about that bracket on a coach chassis or wagon, or mechanism on a signal or whatever, and absolutely nothing else.

I think that is what makes the hobby so rewarding in that there is something for everyone regardless of the angle from which they come at it, or the outcome they seek.

 

[richard carr]

Personally, I think the Gresleys look OK, they aren't perfect but RTR rarely is especially at the lower end of the price scale.

I'm due to get a Dapol MK1 on Monday so it will be interesting to see how they compare given the similar price.

Fortunately I don't need anymore Gresleys, but I could use another 20 mark 1s

Richard

 

[simond]

100% agree. Each to his/her own, rule 1, etc. And being in the moment, in the zone, is really what any hobby is about.

But even if you are going to build a handful of super detailed vehicles, you might think it’s worthwhile having a few RTR (coaches, locos, wagons) if only to get you started and to move them on when you can replace them with something better.

Funnily enough, I was playing with some goods stock yesterday, a brass Macaw B kit built many years back, and a Skytrex one I’d purchased on a whim at a Reading show a few less years back. They are sufficiently comparable that I’d be happy to run either, or both together, and whilst I enjoyed building the brass one, would I want to build another? So if I wanted a third, the options would be to build a kit, or buy second hand (new Skytrex not available afaik) and I’d probably go for the second hand option. As an aside, I noticed I’d not finished numbering the brass one, so I might do that today...

atb
Simon

 

[LarryG]

I think regular builders are the ones most likely to recognize things that would be of enormous benefit to them. Gresley domed roofs are a problem solved in 4mm scale by Hornby and in 7mm scale by Hattons.

 

[John Ross]

Not seen the Dapol Mk1s, but some of my fellow railway club members bought Darstaed suburban coaches and these are very impressive and less expensive than the Gresley coaches that I bought.

I have been modelling in O gauge for 30 years and my aim is to recreate the period 1955 to 1965 in my bit of Scotland. Things changed very rapidly with the loss of GNSR locos and coaches in the early part, the replacement of LNER coaches with LMS stock and the arrival of BR standard steam in the mid-section and replacement of all of these with Mk1s, class 26s and DMUs in the last part just before most of the GNSR network was closed down. (During the 30 years I have been modelling the only thing that has changed on the remaining part of the line in this area has been the arrival of the Inter7City sets to add to the existing 158/170 units that have seem to have been around for ever).

So I do think R-T-R has a role to play and I will buy things to achieve the era I am attempting to model and hope when it comes out of the box it can be placed on my railway without having to replace or upgrade too many bits.

John

 

[djparkins]

I think regular builders are the ones most likely to recognize things that would be of enormous benefit to them. Gresley domed roofs are a problem solved in 4mm scale by Hornby and in 7mm scale by Hattons.

Actually Kemilway kits solve this problem in a rather interesting way and which is pretty well foolproof.

I was a professional coach builder back in the 1970s and we had to produce full length trains for Col. Ronnie Hoare’s layout. One quickly learned the value of the old Stan Beeson approach of having replicable parts and jigs. That made 7mm coach building very profitable (though not as profitable as producing kits). Such an approach very much came into it’s own when l built his 30 wagon Aberdeen to King’s Cross fish train. Bodies from marine ply!

Good money for the time! Then etchings changed everything and the first time I saw them used for Col. Hoare was in the production of a ten coach rake for his Queen of Scots Pullman train to go behind his Beeson A3. His A4 was reserved for the fish train!

I don’t know what happened to the tooling for the pullmans but it was good. Anyway they went on to develop their all-singing Stanier Period III stock as kits, but they were too expensive for the time. What goes around comes around though and l now have the tooling for them. Not that it really cost me anything and would probably still be unviable to produce. Those coaches were ahead of their time and now time has overtaken them!!!

Those were truly exciting times in the hobby and l remember the late Adrian Swain saying to me just months before he died, that for him too it was great to be doing our work at that time. Only thing for me though, is I still feel the same today!

 

[Focalplane]

I have a lot of half built kit coaches and I do enjoy building them even if I have yet to finish them completely.

I too await the Dapol Mk1s but I think my choice is not a priority. It’s been so long since I ordered mine I can’t remember its exact livery! In some ways kit building at a snails pace is faster than the time between product announcement and delivery!

Gresley coaches did come to Birmingham New Street and may have passed by Moor Street on a football semi final special but I expect none will be seen in my railway room!

 

[James Fibbens]

I think for those, like myself, who are looking to build up decent length rakes in a short space of time, these coaches are great value for money compared to what has come before. I am not an LNER expert by any means and can't comment on accuracy, however after a bit of subtle weathering I think they look the part, and perhaps more realistic than an equivalent string of Heljan Mk.1s with their more toy-like appearance and apparent shape errors. I already have four and will be looking to get a few more when finances and time allow.

The only slight gripe, as others have mentioned, is the fragility of certain parts, or rather perhaps, the stinginess in gluing that seems to have been adopted. All four coaches I have had bits that had broken off floating around inside the box upon first opening. Nothing that can't be rectified easily, but still a shame to need to do this on a new model, regardless of value.

 

[richard carr]

Thats very nice James, it really does improve the look of the coach.

Richard

 

[john lewsey]

Agreed it looks good to me
John

 

[LarryG]

Very realistic weathering on the model. Gutters were black though although they were invariably indistinguishable from the roof colour when weathered...

 

[Scale7JB]

Will Hattons be producing a Full Brake at all? Same with Dapol Mk1’s?

JB.

 

[Overseer]

Larry’s photo shows how pale the cream was in b&c livery. Cream paint was traditionally white with some yellow ochre in it. Modern versions seem to be using manufactured yellow pigments which give a different effect, and they are often too ‘strong’ or dark. Varnishes would add yellow but I think BR were using less varnish in the 50s, and possibly polyurethane which doesn’t yellow as much. A long way of saying that most RTR don’t get blood & custard looking right.

 

[John Ross]

I think for those, like myself, who are looking to build up decent length rakes in a short space of time, these coaches are great value for money compared to what has come before. I am not an LNER expert by any means and can't comment on accuracy, however after a bit of subtle weathering I think they look the part, and perhaps more realistic than an equivalent string of Heljan Mk.1s with their more toy-like appearance and apparent shape errors. I already have four and will be looking to get a few more when finances and time allow.View attachment 140262

The only slight gripe, as others have mentioned, is the fragility of certain parts, or rather perhaps, the stinginess in gluing that seems to have been adopted. All four coaches I have had bits that had broken off floating around inside the box upon first opening. Nothing that can't be rectified easily, but still a shame to need to do this on a new model, regardless of value.

Hi James

Have you managed to use the couplings as supplied or replaced them with an alternative?

Thanks

John