Heljan Deltic Discussion

[mickoo]

Richard

If you are serious about your Deltics then I suggest you avail yourself to two tomes :-

Irwell Press 'The Book of The Deltics'
Ian Strange 'Deltic De-Mythology'

The latter lists about every variant in almost obsessive detail, you will not find it on the internet, it is email order only from ian'at'ac2litre.com price is around £10-£12

For your information D9002 was fitted with cast bogies on 23rd October 1965, and that, as they say, you can take to the bank .

HTH Michael

 

[BrushType4]

Richard,

If you don't mind, a Deltic from Central East Anglia may find itself on a workbench near you!

 

[tomstaf]

Watching with interest, will be following this shortly once a cheque clears! Few other things I want to change as well, the cab....all of it, just rubbish, looks like it is possible to make a pretty close representation of the walk ways behind the cab and partitions and still avoid the motor flywheel, may open one or two doors, but will decide that when it arrives. Bonnet covers look too thick so thin them down, maybe even etched working ones? Depends on how I feel on the day. Cab screen, not sure about this, looks a trite small, could just be the really think perspex they use but am considering opening them right out to the internal supports and then adding a PE front or thin plasticard front with PE frames for that extra thin look. Front buffer beam...removal and correct shape and depth added. Bogies, as you note, only suitable for a early green loco so they will be changed as you are. Cab step to be opened out to correct depth and hand rails added, also open out hand brake recess for correct hand brake lever that goes up inside bodywork.Oh and S7 and any other detail I find along the way. I just hope Tower does not sell out before the funds clear!

I have two further purchases when the cheque clears and that will be my five models, nothing else until they are done...ha ha! Seriously, two Brass steamers, two diesel kits, one RTR rebuild.

If you are serious about your Deltics then I suggest you avail yourself to two tomes :-

Irwell Press 'The Book of The Deltics'
Ian Strange 'Deltic De-Mythology'

The latter lists about every variant and anorak detail in almost obsessive detail, you will not find it on the internet, it is email order only from ian'at'ac2litre.com price is around £10-£12

For your information D9002 was fitted with cast bogies on 23rd October 1965, and that, as they say, you can take to the bank .

Mine will be #19 in 1981, last one to cop and my only hauler.

HTH Michael

Hi Mike,

Whilst all the flaws mentioned need sorting the biggest offence of all (as ever for Heljan) is a massively flawed body shape. You can correct if with a large file, endless grades of wet and dry, and lots of patience. If you add all the stuff that Richard is thinking doing plus your own stuff and re shape it then you'll be on to a winner. See the pics below for the flaw - basically HJ made the Delitc flat and left out the tumbleholme and the nose got the 20pence treatment as opposed the the nice curve it should have. HTH




EDIT Forgot to say - prototype photo came from here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/73745145@N06/7636883892/

Cheers

Tom

 

[mickoo]

Tom, Ewwee didn't know about the tumbleholme, that could be painful! And a potential deal breaker for me.

 

[Phill Dyson]

Would the DJH Deltic kit be better for you Mick ?

 

[mickoo]

Would the DJH Deltic kit be better for you Mick ?

Phil, yes and no, the DJH prices favourably for what it is and the shape does look very good but there are other issues, six of one and half a dozen of another I'm afraid.

 

[Dikitriki]

Whoa Mick!

Jubilee, Princess, G3, 5'' S7, Deltic, Std 5, something - anything - JLTRT.

Can I very deferentially suggest you actually get stuck into something. While I'm sure your single-handed attempt to rescue the economy is appreciated, you're in danger of an indecision short-circuit me thinks.

All the best.

Richard

 

[Dog Star]

Can I very deferentially suggest you actually get stuck into something.
Richard

Sounds like good advice from Doctor Trikidiki... please write a prescription for me as well.

Yours, malady at the ready, Graham

 

[alcazar]

I hadn't realised that the Heljan ddeltic was so far out. It's rather put me off wanting one, too.

What about a DJH one with better grilles?

 

[Dikitriki]

Hi Mick

It was only a light-hearted 'I can't keep up with this' sort of comment. There's no need as far as I can see to edit any posts; indeed, I find your posts interesting and informative.

Nor is there any need to achieve before you post. Strewth, if I waited until I finished anything, I'd never post.

Due apologies for cluttering up a thread.

Richard

 

[mickoo]

Hi Mick

It was only a light-hearted 'I can't keep up with this' sort of comment. There's no need as far as I can see to edit any posts; indeed, I find your posts interesting and informative.

Nor is there any need to achieve before you post. Strewth, if I waited until I finished anything, I'd never post.

Due apologies for cluttering up a thread.

Richard

Richard, no problem, but you do have a valid point.

I have only edited the crap out, it's the OPS thread on his Deltics and in my heady scatter gun way forgot that!

 

[mickoo]

I hadn't realised that the Heljan ddeltic was so far out. It's rather put me off wanting one, too.

What about a DJH one with better grilles?

The DJH roof grills are not too bad, but being etches with two radi require patience and dexterity to form correctly and achieve a nice finish that matches the roof curves, they would also benefit from some additional work inside if you want to replicate the area accurately.

HTH

 

[tomstaf]

The Deltic can be corrected with a big file but as I said but its tons of work. Brian (shawplan) carries a corrected body around on his stands so you can see what it looks like. He's got a bit of a Deltic fettish. Luckily the body is thick enough to file to the correct shape but will be a pita when you've spent £100s to buy one in the first place. It's such a pity HJ didn't take the tons of advice offered before they produced it.

Cheers

Tom

 

[alcazar]

That's just it: they don't seem bothered...and while folk will pay half a thousand £ for a sub-standard model, why should they?

 

[BrushType4]

That's just it: they don't seem bothered...and while folk will pay half a thousand £ for a sub-standard model, why should they?

It's still cheap for what you get. I know Heljan locos are not 100% perfect but they are at least 90% right and minor tweaks and etches supplied by the trade will improve to 94-5% right. Still not perfect but when compard to the price of a kit and the time/ability to complete they are a price I'm happy with, possibly a bargin to be honest.

How often in everyday life do we get over 90% of what we want, wish for? Indeed in education circles, it would be excellent!

Back on thread, I'm looking forward to seeing Richards work on the Deltic

 

[Bob Reid]

Without a doubt Phil! - In fact Richard's Deltics are so bad I'd happily take them off his hands as a gift should he be so inclined!

Bob.

 

[mickoo]

It depends on what 10% is wrong does it not? It could be, and is in this case, that the 10% error will take 90% of the time to resolve.

It is good value, especially if you manage to pick one up cheaper than stock, but at full RRP the faults are close to deal breakers....for me at least.

For those interested the dimensions of the relevant area are :-

Max width 2.683m - Given as 1.994m above rail head, in laymans terms, name plate height
Solebar width 2.343m - Same as nose width where blue/yellow paint boundary is.
Tumblehome radius 3.050m

HTH

 

[Ressaldar]

herewith my DJH efforts from about five years ago, hope that it helps answer more questions than it raises - built as best I could from the box, once DJH had eased the two sides so that they actually met where they should have





cheers

Mike

 

[mickoo]

Richard, please don't get me wrong, I never said I didn't like it, I like it a lot, having seen Phils in the flesh a few weeks back I like it a hell of a lot. All models and modelling is a compromise, it's personal and subjective as to what each individual accepts as a compromise, doesn't make anyone persons views better than anyone else's, just different.

There are many many things I will accept compromise on...to the horror and disdain of many others I'm sure, but, Deltic tumblehome (within reason) is not one of them and yes, painful to a Deltic nutter like me, it may well end up in a nil purchase because I know the pain of knowing it is wrong will be far greater than missing the opportunity to own one.

What I'd like to know is the 'exact' width of the model at the nameplate and solebar and thus calculate how far out it is, if were only talking a few mm then I could probably live with that, in laymans terms 10% error will need sorting, less than 5% I'll live with, it maybe the that whomever has adjusted their Heljan tumblehome is not happy with even a 5% error? In which case I may be worrying about jack all and Tower will have a purchase in due course.

The almost matt finish on your image does hide the tumblehome very well, I think the high gloss finish in Toms view exaggerates it as well.

Yellow panels are a mine field! There are many subtle variants dependent on loco and time, it'd be impossible for preservationists to replicate accurately, plus I think in today's HSE environment the panel has to be above a specific area (m³) which is greater than was allowed in the 60's.

Kindest

 

[marsa69]

I'd like people to watch the HJ and DJH Deltics (and a NQLTRT if needs be) whizz around Phill's Withercombe Branch at a scale 100mph with 10 on, and spot all the flaws and differences then......

That's torn it, TAKE COVER, incoming