Highland Railway wagons

[Overseer]

The time has come for a thread on a topic which could be considered obscure and is almost certainly outwith the interests of the majority of WT members. The thread is intended to look at and discuss the goods rolling stock operated by the Highland Railway during the 1870s with historic photos and model examples built over the last 20 years. Updates will be occasional. Hopefully there will be something to interest most at some point along the way.

We will start the story in the middle. The later history of Highland Railway rolling stock is better known and more often modelled while the early history has mostly been lost. Clues exist in historic photographs and I am working on building some of the earlier wagons. Membership of the Highland Railway Society is recommended for anyone with an interest and they have substantial collections of photographs, drawings and ephemera.

As a starting point, the following photograph was apparently taken at Barmouth in 1924. It shows a Highland Railway Type C open wagon designed by David Jones. The photograph has been published several times and I have a faded contact print of the original negative in my collection. Remarkably, the wagon shown was 50 years old at the time of the photograph, and still in near original condition. Most of this type of wagon were rebuilt to a different design by Peter Drummond after 1896.

And a slightly manipulated version of the image to show some of the detail more clearly.


A Scale7 model of one of the type C wagons, from one of my Archibald Works resin kits.


Next time I will look at the features of this type of wagon that make it typical of David Jones' designs and unlike any other wagons of the time. It is just a couple of things..... can you spot them?

 

[Dog Star]

As a starting point, the following photograph was apparently taken at Barmouth in 1924. It shows a Highland Railway Type C open wagon designed by David Jones. The photograph has been published several times and I have a faded contact print of the original negative in my collection.

I have that photo - or one which is very similar - that Geoff Platt gave to me circa 1970. Geoff knew the photographer and he told me the date / location as you indicated.

A Scale7 model of one of the type C wagons, from one of my Archibald Works resin kits.

Please ask Mr. Archibald to tell us more about his products.

It is just a couple of things..... can you spot them?

The narrow headstocks and buffers were an appearance which is not contemporary with the build date suggest that this wagon was built with dumb buffers and has been converted, probably before the RCH required the conversion process to include a plate to that effect.
An interesting style of crown plate, not seen that before (or... not paid much attention to HR wagonry until now).

Thank you, an interesting post, regards, Graham

 

[Mike W]

The photograph was taken by Jim Richards. He took a great many photos at this time in preparation for his modelling projects over the next 50 years. I probably have the original negative here somewhere, but the HMRS took copy negs of them and most are available from them as prints.

Very nice model and I look forward to hearing more about it, and its brothers.

Mike

 

[Mike W]

By the way, for those of us who are keen to get details as correct as we can - look at the height of the buffers compared to the wagon on the right. And remember these were in service and not stuffed into a siding awaiting scrap!

Mike

 

[Osgood]

Unusual rebate in the solebar undersides above the axleboxes, and the spring slipper mounts?

I think the opening of any window into the past - however narrow the field of view - is going to be of interest, and sometimes a more detailed study of a restricted view is much more so.

For example I have no great passion in the Highland Rly, but have always admired their 'quirky' approach to timber wagon construction, and am captivated whenever I see the Highland modelled (thanks to the work of Richard Chown and your own posts here - show us more please!).

In fact I went deep fishing only yesterday in the Bay of E and caught this large scale drawing. I've not had a chance to study it yet but it appears undated - although my guess is it will date from quite a bit later than your intended study period?

 

[Bill Bedford]

I'm looking for a good photo of the HR 7 ton timber wagon, any pointers would be much appreciated.

 

[Overseer]

I'm looking for a good photo of the HR 7 ton timber wagon, any pointers would be much appreciated.

Bill

I wasn't planning to get to the type L (diag. 7) timber wagons for some time. The best photo I have seen is a side view of number 687 which is published in both Carriages & Wagons of the Highland Railway by DLG Hunter and The Highland Railway Company and its Constituents and Successors 1855-1955 by the Stephenson Locomotive Society. The second one is a better copy. Other wise they appear in the background of quite a few photographs. The second edition of The Highland Railway by David Ross has an interesting photo of a train of them on p156 taken after 1911.

 

[Overseer]

Thanks for the comments, and thanks to Mike W for identifying the photographer as I don't think I have seen Jim Richards being credited previously when it has been published. I won't have time to put the next instalment together over the weekend. Explaining the code system and diagrams may help, but we will soon head off into territory where the identification of wagons visible in historic photographs has been lost so maybe they should be called prehistoric photographs. Hopefully people will be able to add to the information along the way.

 

[Mike W]

Just to digress for a moment (sorry) I am amazed what Jim Richards photographed in the Barmouth area. Bear in mind this was just after the Grouping and deep into GWR territory, but he found wagons from all corners of the country.

So, if you think this thread on Highland wagons is of no interest to you because you model the west country or deep south, think again!

Mike

 

[JimG]

Just to digress for a moment (sorry) I am amazed what Jim Richards photographed in the Barmouth area. Bear in mind this was just after the Grouping and deep into GWR territory, but he found wagons from all corners of the country.

So, if you think this thread on Highland wagons is of no interest to you because you model the west country or deep south, think again!

I read something a while ago about a wagon traffic count at a location on the GWR in pre-group days. The largest group of wagons came from the GWR itself - close to 40% IIRC, the next was the LNWR with about 20% and following them was the Caledonian and North British with about 10% each. I can't remember if the Highland featured on this list. Likewise, there was an article on the wagon count of traffic on the Callander and Oban line of the Caledonian in the CRA magazine some years ago which showed a large proportion of wagons from English companies, as well as from the other Scottish companies.

Jim.

 

[Osgood]

Just received that van drawing - it is dated 9/8/11 so that rules it very much Off Topic. I guess the Drummond signature was a clue?

More worryingly it is to just under 5" scale......

 

[hrmspaul]

Bill

I wasn't planning to get to the type L (diag. 7) timber wagons for some time. The best photo I have seen is a side view of number 687 which is published in both Carriages & Wagons of the Highland Railway by DLG Hunter and The Highland Railway Company and its Constituents and Successors 1855-1955 by the Stephenson Locomotive Society. The second one is a better copy. Other wise they appear in the background of quite a few photographs. The second edition of The Highland Railway by David Ross has an interesting photo of a train of them on p156 taken after 1911.

If you think LMS 292919 and 292910 are HR wagons, then I will send you scans of a pair I have two photos of - very good photos as well. They are not my copyright, and were taken near Pond House, Billingham. Not dated, but wagon alongside is E17402 - so BR period. The three share a load of 3 considerable logs destined for plywood manufacturing.

I know nowt about HR wagons but suspect they have been upgraded - have RCH split oil axleboxes, although a very simple buffer like your model. And they have no crown plate at all!

I cannot see your name or email address, please send both to bartlett.paul@tiscali.co.uk if you would like the scans.

Paul Bartlett

 

[Overseer]

Just received that van drawing - it is dated 9/8/11 so that rules it very much Off Topic. I guess the Drummond signature was a clue?

More worryingly it is to just under 5" scale......

Are you sure it is 5" scale? Usually wagons are drawn at 1" to 1' or 1 1/2" to 1'. 1" to 1' would be close to 5" gauge.

The drawing of the van would be the contract drawing for 20 vans built by RY Pickering in early 1912 for £120 each, numbers 1158 to 1177. There is even a photograph of 1168 published in Hunter's book. This is more information than I will be able to quote for most of my models of the earlier wagons. So not totally off topic, just a diversion.

 

[Osgood]

Are you sure it is 5" scale? Usually wagons are drawn at 1" to 1' or 1 1/2" to 1'. 1" to 1' would be close to 5" gauge.....

Yes - sorry, I meant 5" gauge! And thanks for the additional information!

 

[Overseer]

Before starting on the details of Highland Railway rolling stock it makes sense to look at the commonly used terminology and its origin. David Hunter wrote Carriages & Wagons of the Highland Railway incorporating all the information available when it was published in 1971. The goods stock section amounts to only six pages of text plus some photographs and copies of diagrams which look like they were drawn with a biro. There was a second edition planned with better drawings and the text was revised during the late 1980s, but this was never completed. The revised text was released in draft form by the Highland Railway Society but the goods stock text is barely altered. Most of the documented information is based on a diagram book compiled by Peter Drummond in 1901, in which each wagon type was allocated a diagram number and the earlier 'Type' designations were also included, as well as the wagon numbers. This information is all included in Hunter. However, there are a number of problems with the diagram book information. Anything scrapped before the diagram book is not included, Drummond had been Locomotive Superintendent since 1896 and was in the process of rebuilding lots of the wagons to his design with different dimensions but seems not to have felt different diagram numbers were necessary, and the diagram book seems not to have been consistently updated up to grouping. If you are modelling circa 1900 things should be straight forward, but it isn't that simple. If you are modelling before 1901 there is lots of confusion because we don't have enough information to be definitive on what was built and what the wagons were called. After 1901 is clearer but not completely so. There is also lots of misinformation and incorrect assumptions in some of the published material.

So, after that, the wagon in the first post above is what is referred to as a Type C open wagon. The model is of the original condition as designed by David Jones. The prototype photo is of a wagon which avoided being rebuilt by Drummond and has only been modified by the replacement of the original 3'6" (nominal) wheels with 3' wheels and the later lettering on the body. Type C became Diagram 6 in Drummond's diagram book. As I model the Jones period I tend to use the Type designations and avoid the confusion of having both Jones and Drummond versions of similar but significantly different wagons with the same diagram number. This may all become clearer with some illustrations in future posts.

Now, as I warned we will start looking at the Highland Railway wagons from the middle, with wagons designed by David Jones. David Jones was a remarkably high profile Locomotive Superintendent during the 19th Century considering the remoteness and lack of finances the Highland Railway operated with. He spent part of his apprenticeship with John Ramsbottom on the LNWR before moving to Inverness in 1855 at the age of 20, just before the formation of the Highland Railway from its constituents. He worked his way up through the works and was appointed Locomotive Superintendent on Stroudley's departure in 1870 (35 might seem young for such a position but Stroudley was only a year older than Jones and he had spent 5 years in the role before going to Brighton). Jone resigned in 1896 following an injury while testing a Jones Big Goods locomotive. An interesting point is that there seems to be no identifiable evidence of Stroudley's input into carriage or wagon design on the Highland Railway and it is likely that Jones was responsible for the non-locomotive rolling stock throughout Stroudley's time in Inverness.

Jones' wagons were distinctive. Dog Star noticed the narrow headstocks, these are characteristic of Jones designs but not because they were converted from dumb buffers. He did build some dumb buffered wagons, which we will look at, but most of the open wagons were built with sprung buffers. An iron corner plate was used to reinforce each corner between the headstocks and solebars. Dog Star also noted the inverted T 'crown' plates which were Jones signature detail. The left hand inverted T also incorporated the horse hooks so had a thicker bottom piece. This thicker piece has caused a shadow in the prototype photograph which Osgood took to be a rebate in the solebar - it isn't, the solebar is a standard straight timber. The spring shoes are characteristic but not so different from other contemporary wagons. Apart from the narrow headstocks the really unusual feature of Jones' wagons is the lack of a curb rail and the unusual width of the body (not obvious in the side on view). Jones wagons are nearly all 8 feet wide over the body instead of 7'7" or so. Instead of a curb rail a longitudinal floor plank was supported on a series of iron angle brackets, and carried the wagon side. Forged iron outside knees were also used instead of inside knees. Larger 3'6" wheels were used on most wagons designed by Jones instead of the more common 3' wagon wheel. All this adds up to wagons which are unlike any other open wagons in Britain. I am not aware of any written comments by Jones on his wagons or why he went his own way but there is definitely logic to each of his variations from the 'standard' wagon construction. They were certainly successful as these wagons appear in early 1870s photographs and Jones kept on building them until he left the Highland. I don't know how many survived basically unaltered until Grouping, but at least one did.

Now that is all out of the way, next time there will be photographs. Speaking of photographs, if anybody has any Highland Railway photographs in their collection I would be very interested to see them.

 

[Overseer]

Type C open box wagon

The first post had a photograph of a Type C wagon in 1924 and a model of this type in the earlier condition with larger wheels. Without a visible number plate it is probably impossible to tell the difference between a Type C wagon and some of the other similar types with 2" higher sides and slightly differing lengths. The diagrams do not make clear which types had doors. Type A was slightly lower and didn't have doors but I am not certain about Types D, E and F. It is hard to be definitive when the Type C diagram shows the dimensions of the Drummond rebuilds while the others are mostly still the Jones dimensions. Anyway there were 646 Type C wagons listed on the 1901 diagram book and smaller numbers of the other types. In 1864 the Highland had 764 open wagons and 1,489 open wagons by 1889, but what did they all look like? At least some appear in photographs so we will look at them in future posts. I just found that Noodle Books are to publish a book by Peter Tatlow on the subject of Highland Railway carriages and wagons in March so hopefully lots of these questions will be answered.

So some 1870s photographs of Type C wagons. These are very small parts of postcard views taken by George Washington Wilson and now held by Aberdeen University library. The collection is online and well worth a look.

Two Highland Railway Type C wagons at Forres. The tarpaulin is interesting and we will look at more examples later.


A Type C wagon being unloaded on the pier at Strome Ferry. The steamer hiding behind the pier is SS Ferret, a strangely named ship owned by the Highland Railway which later achieved world wide fame by being stolen, disappearing, then being identified in Melbourne (it had been renamed India along the way) and the culprits arrested. An interesting story but too much of a diversion at the moment.

And some model views.

2246 as seen previously.


The wheel size makes a considerable difference to the appearance of the wagon. The right hand wagon is still unfinished, missing brakes and number plates.


And a bit of a train. The wagon bodies are polyurethane resin castings from a master I made using Peter Tatlow's drawing HR/W/09 which is available from the Highland Railway Society. I released these as kits under the Archibald Works name in 1999 and sold a few, well about 20 from memory. The number plate on 2246 is a dry transfer I had made by 4D Modelshop, as is the HR illiteracy symbol.

Next time a similar open wagon, the Type A, but any questions are welcome in the meantime.

 

[Overseer]

I hadn't planned to post this but it may be of interest to some. I am also not sure whether posting pdf files works.

To help with trying to explain the mysteries of Highland Railway wagons I spent a bit of time putting the information from the 1901 diagrams onto a spreadsheet. I have excluded the diagrams with no Type designation included in Hunter as these are almost certainly post 1901 additions. The Highland were orderly with numbers so there was a block of numbers allocated to each new wagon type, then another block for the next batch of the same type. The spreadsheet made it obvious that the 1901 diagram numbers were sequential, based on the lowest number of each wagon type (with a couple of exceptions). This is looks like an accountants way of looking at things. The logic assumes that the lowest numbers were the earliest, even though it is likely that numbers had been reallocated to new vehicles over the years.

Resorting the table based on the Type designation produces quite a different appearance with the wagons neatly sorted by function, apparently open wagons started at A while vans start at Y and work backward so the odd or special vehicles are in the middle of the alphabet. There appears to be no Type Z and there are two different Type S vans listed. I do not know when the Type letters were allocated, probably not from the beginning. Hopefully a reference has been found in the company minutes and someone will be able to clarify this. I have also provided total numbers for each type, based on the numbers listed. It may be worth noting that the dimensions given may not be correct for all the wagons in a group due to rebuilding - it seems that some of the dimensions have been revised to Drummond's narrower body width (7'7") while others remain at Jones 8' width.

The brake vans are separated out as they are outside the wagon numbering and type system.

HR wagon by type.pdf

It is a pity that so many of the records have been lost.
Photos next time.

 

[Bill Bedford]

I believe the second edition of Carriages and Wagons of the Highland Railway has been completed by Peter Tatlow and is due in the near future. It is listed as such on Amazon.

 

[Overseer]

I believe the second edition of Carriages and Wagons of the Highland Railway has been completed by Peter Tatlow and is due in the near future. It is listed as such on Amazon.

I noticed this the other day too. It will be good to have all Peter Tatlow's drawings together and hopefully he has delved a bit further into the early history than Hunter could.

 

[Overseer]

Types A and B Goods Wagons

This was my first scratchbuilt Highland Railway wagon, built in styrene sheet. I think it still looks ok but not as good as later wagons. I can't remember how it ended up being as accurate as it is considering the drawing it was based on, by K Norris published in the January 1969 Model Railway Constructor is an odd mix of Jones and Drummond details and dimensions. I must have looked at photographs. I also thought I was building a Type A wagon, as the drawing was titled, but on looking at it recently it is actually a model of a Type B wagon with slightly higher sides. Both types were very similar and had no doors. The fittings were the same as the Type C wagons with all the characteristic Jones details.



This photograph, published a number of times including in Modelling Railways Illustrated March 1995, shows a Type A wagon at Dalwhinnie with a Type C wagon closer to the camera.