Mickoos European dabblings

Discussion in 'Area 51' started by mickoo, 6 September 2015.

  1. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    Ah yes, at GdN years ago, the Eurostar 1st class lounge overlooked the "SNCF Centre Médical" which had a sign a little below saying "Entrée à l'Arrière"...

    Actually, I think the Javelin staff on the HS1 refer to the Eurostars in much the same way.
    Focalplane likes this.
  2. King Crab

    King Crab Active Member

    Bit late , took a while to find the snaps on my hard drive.
    Clear view of a V200 front end, for reference.
    The line passes by just at the end of our lane......

    Peter 150601.AMHAGEN.2.1 copy.jpg 150601.AMHAGEN.3.2 copy.jpg
  3. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Pushing the new 3D printer today. Sometimes the stars align, not perfectly, but enough to show you the way forward.

    For those who have no idea what it is I'll explain and save y'all looking back in the thread, it's a Br110 cab module, Germanys most prolific class of electric locomotive, they come in two flavours, standard cab and this, the Bugelfaltre which roughly translates to crease stemming from the ridge running down the middle of the cab.

    I've wanted a Bugelfaltre for as long as I can remember and kits are non existent, I don't think there's even a RTR version, not unless you want to part with several thousand £££.

    Drawing it up in CAD was a challenge but the hobby printer failed miserably and I'd all but given up of ever making one.

    But, the new printer does a much better job, it's not perfect by along short, some mild warpage and I've not built in any sacrificial edges to help that and aid post clean up. One of the windscreen recesses has blown through and the left side window openings are a little rough on the top edge, not big issues as there's a thin etch with rubber beading designed to fit in the windscreen and quarter lights.

    Initially I was going to just mount this on an etch frame but looking at the 1:1 photo (Hamburg in my youth spotting days) it'll be better if I add the lower section as well plus the door step recess, I'll also add the gutter strip and more details.

    The door window now needs an internal recess to take the window and a design revision to stop the top edge being so rough.

    So, for a rough throw it in the printer and see what happens I'm more than pleased, actually that's a bit of a gross understatement :cool:






  4. adrian

    adrian Flying Squad

    So you should be - that's pretty damn good to my untutored eye. Normally you can tell when something has been 3D printed, the striations and layer lines around compound curves usually gives the game away. Maybe the faintest trace of lines inside the top headlight housing but otherwise that looks like a full resin casting from a master to me.
    mickoo likes this.
  5. SimonT

    SimonT Western Thunderer

    I would say that is the dog's bollucks for a first shot with that shape. (Archie say's "If they are his, can he have tham back";)).

    I had some success by making the window recesses deeper and then filing back. This allows plenty of supports in the area without worrying about their effect on the outside finish. I had an idea to put a 'half etch' marker line on the surface to indicate how far to file back to but never got to try it.
    Lancastrian, cmax and mickoo like this.
  6. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    More Bugelfaltre, some good, some bad.

    The quarter light and cab door window frames blew through in places (orientation) and the joint between cab and #2 end wasn't the best. However a trick from the miniature modellers makes a lovely smooth joint even though the darker gap can be seen underneath on one side.

    The vents came out nicely except their fixing rivets didn't export over from CAD on this run :rant:, all the pre test ones did. The roof covers are ok but an error in the body recess finds them a little loose. The recess will allow all three types of vent to be fitted if required, these being the smallest and hence determine the size of the required recess.

    Not sure on the pantograph supports, they look ok but the resin is a witch to get flat and smooth to match the roof profile, I could employ the trick above and blend them in....tricky....or some other method not yet devised.....the answer will be in the bottom of a beer glass, the question is how many do I have to empty to find it :cool:

    Buffer beam and front end fittings are pretty much perfect, the brass tubes will be soldered to a brass sheet bonded to the inside as will the coupling hook at some point.

    I am tempted to make these two units as one and print as such, it will fit, but at 19 hour print it only needs one small defect to destroy a lot of time and resin. Once again another beer glass bottom solution will present it's self, probably not in the same one as above....sigh :D




  7. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Rapidly came to the same conclusion, hence MkIII will have such features as well as sacrificial edges in other important places.
    Podartist79 and cmax like this.
  8. SimonT

    SimonT Western Thunderer

    For something that is pigging ugly it looks rather good:p. The join has worked very nicely. If you can get joints like that I would forget the 19hour build and make it the Johnny Cash way, but do try to do it all in one year!
    Rob Pulham and mickoo like this.
  9. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Cheers, I'll let you know in 12 hrs how the combined cab/traction motor vent module came out.

    Currently it's split into five pieces. A cab either end....obviously, two traction motor vent rooms and the centre transformer and power section. A recess in the roof will hold the raised roof section (with four pegs to lock the vent rooms in place) over the power module, note, it's longer at one end, which is a pain as it means each vent room has a different roof section recess.


    Each section interlocks with it's neighbour, at the lower floor level with tapered peg and recess joints, mid side and roof with tabs (not yet modelled on the middle section).


    The bulged areas will have knurled nutserts fitted, 10 or 8BA or what ever fits in the hole really (no forward planning here then :))), these'll hold a full length brass or NS floor in place, for added strength the floor will fold down at the edges and end flush with the bottom of the resin body sides.

    The first joint behind the cab is close to the door recess and the outer pantograph supports....not ideal. I also tried a print that was split between vents 1/2 (not 3/4 and 5/6 as above) but again the pantograph supports at the inner end are near the joint. The problem with a split at vent 2/3 is how to split the mid section up effectively.

    A middle section running from 2/3 to 5/6 is massive and can only be printed vertically, it'd work, vertical orientation works really well but ramps the time up. The cab fronts can't realistically be done vertically as the nose ends up being printed last, which due to the way this type of process works, leaves the door wide open to distortion or faults in an area that is hard to recover.

    Ideally the less joints the better, however, one single fault or error is a massive waste of material.

    Currently the power module has a opening (window) in the middle, that only came later with (I believe) service up grades in later lives, but the opening is the same size as the vents so a vent can be fitted for those engines with full length grills.
  10. paratom

    paratom Western Thunderer

    The 3D prints look fantastic, what printer are you using?
  11. michl080

    michl080 Western Thunderer

    Very exciting. A well know "Neubau E-Lok" that can still be seen today. Unfortunately this class was seen so frequently that I don't have any picture.

    I hope you are not planning to use BA screws in a German engine, would you? :eek:

  12. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Cheers, it's a Form3.
  13. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    Shsss, no one will ever know ;)

    My biggest problem is that it's not fast enough :eek:, I'm drawing CAD objects faster than it can print :cool:

    A few long term 'want's have moved up the interest table, a DSB Mz, any Mk will do, the SNCB HLD 55/62 and the NS 16/17/18xx cab would be a perfect for 3D printing....which then opens doors to a raft of SNCF locos.
    Last edited: 27 March 2021
    Podartist79 likes this.
  14. paratom

    paratom Western Thunderer

    What software are you using to do the CAD drawings?

  15. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    I use Autocad but it's becoming too restrictive, I may go back to Studio Max which was killer for complex and compound shapes, or, move onto something else more suited to 3D work.

    The problem with studio max is that it deals in real units which flight and train sims use as they model real world environments scale wise, what it didn't do so well was scaled units, it couldn't cope with vertices so close together.

    Citation X was probably the most exciting project I did, I'm no fan of biz jet but this little baby was superb and the contract manager a dream to work for, every one knew their place and work boundary, probably the best project I ever did.

    Citation X render V2_05 BETA.jpg

    Still born Phantom project just before I threw the towel in.

    F-4 FGR2_08.jpg

    Still born rail sim models before the group went bust with the owner ripping everyone off, sour grapes, not all, don't like being taken for a ride and ripped off out of pocket.

    Class 40 2x.jpg

    Class 40_03.jpg

    Rail sim was much lower fidelity than flight sim, simply down to the sheer number of models you get in one scene at a station or yard, trains sim didn't use LOD, still doesn't as far as I know. Flight sim did and the difference on frame rates and detail was marked.
  16. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    Can you import the Studio Max models into other CAD, via IGES or STEP?

    I’m willing to try on Solidworks if it would help.

  17. mickoo

    mickoo Western Thunderer

    I seem to recall it would export as a stl file.

    It's nearly 15 years ago since I used it, it might pay to try an export into Autocad and then resize in there or some other route.

    I'd need to dig it out and re-install it, if it'll even work on Win7 64 bit that is :eek:
  18. michl080

    michl080 Western Thunderer

    Sadly, there is no way to import CAD Files from one system to another one. All you can get is a dumb blob that lost all parametric features.

    Btw., I am using solidworks at home with a license from my EAA-society membership. I have to admit that i don't have any interest in experimental aircraft, but 40 USD a year for a SW-license is unbeatable.