O Gauge Heljan 33 Improvements and JLTRT MK2s.

[mickoo]

Tom, can you make up 'wheels' of these door-lock indicators - that would avoid the need to make a base for them as they can support each other. You could make 4 units per 'wheel' then get them printed on a per coach basis.

The only problem with that is the vertical axis at some point you will get ridges across the face of the lens, some with none and some with diagonals but I like your thinking

 

[tomstaf]

Tom, ok I can see your Gizmo axis is the industry standard ie Z is vertical and Y is forward and looking at your printing it looks like Shapeways uses Y as vertical which would fit the spining view I get with my cabs.

At the moment your large base block follows the Y axis, you will need to rotate the whole assembly so that the large base block follows the Z axis, in other words up end your part so that it's standing up and looking like a big traffic light signal, not one flat on its back, I'll try and check the Shapeways help info and see if theres any other help in their, not my intention to 'waste' your money but I still suggest a sacrificial print in the cheapest format possible to ensue the layers are going the way you want.

Seem to recall seeing some 3D stuff in the scale 7 forum and seeing some of his work at Sudbury (no idea who and its very late at the end of a tiring day LOL), whose next meet is this Sunday so he may be there and I'll ask around for thee, so don't get a blood rush and run off and print a load more off LOL.

Thanks Mick,

Sounds like ti confirms what you thought. I had it printed in the UFD partially to get a good definition but mainly to see if the material was suitable for the light. It's turned out translucent enough for my liking and just needs a dab of translucent orange paint to seal the look.

But as you say, seeing as it hasn't started off too well I'll probably follow your recommendation about cheaper material.

I'll wait to see what you can find out over the weekend. I don't have as super an itchy 'buy' finger as SteveO does

Cheers

Tom

 

[tomstaf]

Tom, can you make up 'wheels' of these door-lock indicators - that would avoid the need to make a base for them as they can support each other. You could make 4 units per 'wheel' then get them printed on a per coach basis.

Hi Steve,

Did you mean the actual light touching each other or having linkage pieces that you'd need to cut off the edges of the lights?

Cheers

Tom

 

[Pugsley]

FUD quality seems to be somewhat variable, seemingly down to which facility created the parts, which machine was used and even who was operating it! As far as I know, the parts are created by spraying the resin in layers, along with any support material required by jetting, which is then cured by exposure to UV light. The rough surface finish often seen is apparently down to the support material.

The other downside to Shapeways is that you can't specify the print orientation - even if you upload it in a certain way, they may change it if it fits in with what they're doing better. They are aiming at the mass market though and, as modellers looking for fine detail, I think we're operating at the limits of the technology that Shapeways use.

What size are the lights and the screw heads?

 

[SteveO]

Hi Steve,

Did you mean the actual light touching each other or having linkage pieces that you'd need to cut off the edges of the lights?

Cheers

Tom

Hello Tom, I was thinking that the 'stalks' could join together like spokes of a wheel with the lights at the outside. However, as Mick has wisely pointed out, two of the lights would have the same problem as you have now because they would be on a different axis to the other two. The only way of doing it on stalks would be to get them printed in pairs in the shape of a capital I, with the lights on either end.

 

[mickoo]

Hello Tom, I was thinking that the 'stalks' could join together like spokes of a wheel with the lights at the outside. However, as Mick has wisely pointed out, two of the lights would have the same problem as you have now because they would be on a different axis to the other two. The only way of doing it on stalks would be to get them printed in pairs in the shape of a capital I, with the lights on either end.

Correct, but as pugsley has pointed out, Shapeways do not always use the same axis as vertical and in that case your in the lap of the lucky draw as to where the layers and ridges appear on your printing. It makes sense as Shapeways will be printing a load of stuff in the same tank to maximise production so will orientate parts as best they can to minimise lost space.
Kinda makes them a non starter if you really need to minimise your layer ridges or need high detailed parts, I didnt see these issues on the S7 chairs posted recently, maybe they got lucky, used someone else, insisted on the vertical axis be retained as per the source code.

 

[mickoo]

As far as I know, the parts are created by spraying the resin in layers, along with any support material required by jetting, which is then cured by exposure to UV light. The rough surface finish often seen is apparently down to the support material.

I think you may well be right, I kow there are several ways to achieve the same result and these are advancing/changing all the time.

 

[Stu Fox]

Tom,

Just a minor point on the 33. Do Heljan include the engine speed regulator pipes on the beams? If you look at a 12"/ft image you'll see small diameter pipes on the outside ends under the buffers with white cocks/connectors. I've noticed they are regularly omitted on models.

Regards

Stu

 

[tomstaf]

Tom,

Just a minor point on the 33. Do Heljan include the engine speed regulator pipes on the beams? If you look at a 12"/ft image you'll see small diameter pipes on the outside ends under the buffers with white cocks/connectors. I've noticed they are regularly omitted on models.

Regards

Stu

Hi Stu,

They're there but point downwards instead of upwards and mounted directly onto the buffer beam instead of a pipe coming out from under it.

Cheers

Tom

 

[tomstaf]

The MK2 is making progress now. I'm pleased with about 80% of the etches I've done.

I'm very pleased with how the handrails have come out. I've made them as prototypical as poss even down to how they're attached to the coach side - with real mini 0.4mm bolts! That also should help protect them against handling.

The various holes you can see are the approximations that JLTRT included. Even the ones for their own handrails are too far apart They'll all be filled soon.

The guard's door handle has come out well too and a tiny bit of solder brings it from a 2D etch into 3D form.


The emergency door release handle (part next to the yellow tape) has a small handle which is soldered to 0.33mm brass wire. This is drilled out and the conical recess behind it was done with a 2.5mm drill - simples albeit a tad fiddly. I'll glaze it with some liquid type glazing when I remember who produces it.


Cheers

Tom

 

[mickoo]

That looks good I've no reply from PPD from my etches as yet so getting fidgety and impatient LOL.

What are you using to adhere the brass and NS to the resin sides? There was a discussion recently here on the merits and wherefores for adhesives to stick metal to plastic/resin.

 

[tomstaf]

Thanks Mick,

PPD aren't in my good books either at the mo - still waiting for replacements for the damaged etches. I think their problems is they're a small company with a big customer base. Calling them usually helps.

I didn't see the discussion but I presume it mentioned super glue? I roughen the surfaces lightly with wet and dry/file and then use the zap-a-gap glues. The windows frames went on about 18months ago and no sign of glue issues.

Cheers

Tom

 

[Steph Dale]

Tom,

Those sides look great. Nice neat etches...

Just a shame they're not Manchester Pullman vehicles, which would be a thought.

Steph

 

[mickoo]

Just a shame they're not Manchester Pullman vehicles

Steph

Got a set of drawings for those somewhere.......which reminds me I still need to do those steel carriers for you LOL

 

[tomstaf]

Hi,

Way back at the beginning of this thread I posted my plans to improve the HJ 33. After getting distracted by MK2s and improving my etching skills I'm back with the 33 parts. They'll be divided up between N/S and S/S to ensure correct thickness and strength where needed. I'm about 2/3s way through drawing them up. The parts that I'm including are:

1. Headlight cover*
2. headlight surround*
3. Roof pod*
4. wipers*
5. Multi working supports
6. pipe brackets (various)*
7. Centre snow plough brackets*
8. brake linkages*
9. correct hatched exhaust port
10. horn grill front
11. Sole bar lifting eyelets
12. Cab front horizontal ribbing*
13. fuel tank and battery box mounting brackets
14. vacuum pipe support
15. fan panels
16. headcode panel*
17. Template marker for headlight and 4 bolts*

* stainless steel



Some of the parts are complex curvy bits which have taken an age to get correct in flat form. Eg, those steel strips that replaced the ribs on the cab front. Anyway, not that I've completed the hard bits there are just a few more easier parts to draw up.

Whilst I'm at it can anyone think of any other useful parts to include on the etch?



Cheers

Tom

 

[djparkins]

Hi,

Way back at the beginning of this thread I posted my plans to improve the HJ 33. After getting distracted by MK2s and improving my etching skills I'm back with the 33 parts. They'll be divided up between N/S and S/S to ensure correct thickness and strength where needed. I'm about 2/3s way through drawing them up. The parts that I'm including are:

1. Headlight cover*
2. headlight surround*
3. Roof pod*
4. wipers*
5. Multi working supports
6. pipe brackets (various)*
7. Centre snow plough brackets*
8. brake linkages*
9. correct hatched exhaust port
10. horn grill front
11. Sole bar lifting eyelets
12. Cab front horizontal ribbing*
13. fuel tank and battery box mounting brackets
14. vacuum pipe support
15. fan panels
16. headcode panel*
17. Template marker for headlight and 4 bolts*

* stainless steel




Some of the parts are complex curvy bits which have taken an age to get correct in flat form. Eg, those steel strips that replaced the ribs on the cab front. Anyway, not that I've completed the hard bits there are just a few more easier parts to draw up.

Whilst I'm at it can anyone think of any other useful parts to include on the etch?

View attachment 20609

Cheers

Tom

Tom -

Do you think that SS is a good material to use? It tends to snap when making folds, is generally a highly unpleasant/unforgiving material to work with + a bitch to solder.

I certainly won't be using it for our MMP upgrades for the Heljan 26/27/33 and whilst not wishing to speak out of turn - I would be very interested as to why you would choose to use it?

With Regards,

David
MMP

 

[tomstaf]

Tom -

Do you think that SS is a good material to use? It tends to snap when making folds, is generally a highly unpleasant/unforgiving material to work with + a bitch to solder.
I would be very interested as to why you would choose to use it?

With Regards,

David
MMP

Hi David,

I'm using S/S on the parts that I don't want to bend easily and which are likely to get knocked. So the air pipe supports and wipers are most in danger of being knocked. Also the majority of my parts are designed to be glued onto the model so using S/S won't be a soldering issue. For instance, the brake linkage arms will be joined up using 3D printed pieces for the parts between them so only need glueing. The steel ribbing strips (a late mod to some of the fleet) will be much easier to add after painting and being S/S won't need to be painted. It'd be hard to paint them neatly being only 0.7mm wide and the screw detail would easily fill with paint. Something I'd rather got filled with weathering wash to highlight them. But any parts that need soldering will be done in N/S.

If you need photo dimensions for any of your parts I've got tons of pics with my tape measure and callipers.

Cheers

Tom

 

[djparkins]

If you need photo dimensions for any of your parts I've got tons of pics with my tape measure and callipers.

Cheers

Tom
View attachment 20624

Tom -

That is mighty civil of you, especially as we'll be in competition on this one!!! I think I've got everything I need thanks - if I'm stuck, I'll let you know - but very much appreciated.

Regards,

DJP

 

[tomstaf]

Hi,

Had a bit of a special moment and forgot one of the most important things, the footsteps I also omitted the sand pipe brackets. I've now added those to the list and spent a this afternoon doing even more drawing.



The red sections with the little black square and the tread plates added to the wooden footsteps. My plan is to fold up and solder the two frames together, stick some 0.5mm thick plastic strip on for the wooden planks and then glue the tread plates to the edge of them. I'm trying to make it as simple as possible to assemble. With some metal origami and slot and tab joints, it'll hold itself together whilst you solder it, and they'll only be a few solder joints. Options for steps with the solid and holy frames too. Got to get these beasts as detailed as poss

Cheers

Tom

 

[tomstaf]

Tom -

That is mighty civil of you, especially as we'll be in competition on this one!!! I think I've got everything I need thanks - if I'm stuck, I'll let you know - but very much appreciated.

Regards,

DJP

Hi David,

That's fine. I'm happy to share all my research around if it makes the products available better. I didn't realise you were doing them too. I only produce stuff that I want and if other people want copies of them too, I happily sell them on. But I don't go into it with a business intention. So no plans to have a huge onslaught with my etches. I need you to keep your stuff coming out - ie that 92 and 150 (which I depending on how you design it I want to convert it into a 455) .

Cheers

Tom