7mm On Heather's Workbench - wider and longer

Discussion in 'WR Action' started by Heather Kay, 19 January 2016.

  1. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    More GWR broad gauge malarkey, this time a pair of eight-wheeled coaches.

    As I type, I've photographed the parts, made a list of parts I need, and settled into a head-scratching mode as I ponder the first step.

    Oh my, what have I let myself in for!

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    This is the body kit for a diagram E3 1st/2nd luggage composite. This will be the largest vehicle, being something close to 50ft long. The roof is clerestory, and for once the kit includes partitions. The kit originated from CPL, but is now sold by the Broad Gauge Society.

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    An older and shorter model, this is also a 1st/2nd luggage compo of 42ft or so, diagram E6. Both vehicles I believe have a handbrake and guard accommodation in the central luggage compartment.

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    The BGS underframe kit, of which I gave two to build. One, obviously, will require shortening. Thankfully, neither model will require widening! William Dean did not think bogies were worth the effort, so both these coaches will ride on a rigid eight-wheeled underframe - although, as you can probably tell, the kit provides for a form of radial truck system to cater for less-than-arrow-straight model railways.

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    A selection of cast parts for lamps, underframe details and door vents, plus Slater's seat kits. Oh, what fun I shall have splicing together wide seats from these narrow ones!

    I have prepared a list of parts I need to get to make some shortfall, stuff like buffers, couplings and brake stands.

    The first step, I think, will be to cut out and clean up the sides and ends, form turnunders, and assemble things along the lines of the previous BG coach build: butt-soldering the main parts, with bracing struts across the top and bottom.
     
  2. john lewsey

    john lewsey Western Thunderer

    I must say Heather that your broad guage coaches look really nice so I'm looking forward to the build some of the wagons on the society web site are really quite nice
    John
     
  3. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    Heather

    Might I suggest that you use the Slater's seats to make a master, prepare an RTV silicone mould, and cast your seats in resin?

    It's a relatively simple process, and, providing you don't copy my failures to add sufficient catalyst to the rubber, quite quick too. Of course, once you have the mould, you can make as many as you like!

    I used a kit from Sylmaster, other suppliers are evident on the w3. You can see the wheels for my Corgi Thorneycroft van at Porth Dinllaen in 0 - Page 9 - 7mm+ modelling

    Hth
    Simon
     
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  4. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    Simon, that's a good idea. I've thought about resin casting before, but always shied away for various reasons. I may have to look into it again.
     
  5. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    You know the drill. Cut the sides and ends from the fret, file down the cusps, drill out any door furniture holes, file a slight chamfer on the edges of the mating parts, play a gas torch over the lower parts, carefully form turnunders, fold up the tops and bottoms, apply window frames.

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    Well, that's mostly how it went. The E6, being a slightly older design and etch, needed some additions before the folding and bending routine. The door bumpers were marked out by scribing a line down each hinge line, then another line along the lower hole for the commode handles. Using dividers I marked off a set distance either side.

    Now, previous kits from the IKB stable had holes at this point. Wire was soldered in and tidied up to make the bumpers. On the E3 kit (CPL origin, do try to keep up at the back) the door bumpers were marked out - I assumed for drilling like the door bits. Then I thought it might be worth trying a rivet punch to form the bumpers. It worked, so I repeated the routine on the E6.

    Still with me?

    Well, it saves a lot of messy soldering and filing.

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    I think you can see the result. Incidentally, this kit appears to have been stored on a shelf for quite some time. I got the worst of the tarnishing off with a dose of Viakal and a toothbrush. The rest has gradually been scrubbed away as I worked on the sides and ends, with brass scratch brush and steel whizzywheel.

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    About an hour with the RSU and the window frames are in on the E6. This shot is before tidying up. You can see the remains of the gas flame heating, too.

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    By the close of play, both coach bodies have seen turnunders formed, and the E6 (the shorter one) has all its window frames. I think a session tomorrow will see the frames on the E3 as well.

    I know it ought to be obvious, but I simply can't confirm it - which end of these coaches had the steps? I've studied the few photos I've found of eight-wheelers, which proved inconclusive. By interpreting photos of other period vehicles, I have made an assumption the steps went at the second class end. For those who like to know these things, you can spot first and second class compartments by the width of the panel between them. Seconds were 6ft compartments, with narrower dividing panels; firsts were 7ft with consequently wider panels.

    An interesting feature of the E6 is holes for destination board clips, located in the first long panel in from each end above the windows. This is a feature I shall probably replicate for the E3. Usually, this panel carries the coach number, and what's fun is sometime the number was shifted to the next panel along, and sometime it remained where it would be obscured by the board. The shifted number, however, seems to be a feature of convertible stock, narrow bodies in broad frames, so I wonder if the board clips were a later in-service addition and some BG stock didn't get the number moved before scrapping. It's funny what you discover when studying photos!
     
    Last edited: 8 October 2017
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  6. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    I have been giving thought to resin casting seats for these coaches. It's actually a very good idea, but I'm not really sure it's something I want to add to my skill set at this point.

    So, I'm open to anyone reading this who would like to take a commission to cast a load of seats for me. I'll happily make the masters up. If that sounds like something you would like to do, drop me a PM or an email via my web site in the signature below. Ta!
     
  7. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    As being recounted in a thread elsewhere, Ian (aka @unklian) has kindly stepped forward to cast some seating for me. Making resin moulding masters is a bit of a first for me, but Ian has reassured me that it's not that hard to do.

    As with a previous build in this BG saga I set about cutting and shutting some Slater's injection moulded seat kits. My aim was to provide one each of a second/third class bench and a first class bench. The kits expect the seat backs to fixed to a compartment wall, with a support under the seat bolster. Thinking it through, it made sense to fill the seat bottom in completely - well, box it in at least.

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    Here's the finished result. You can see the joins, but I've spent some little while filling and sanding so I hope they won't actually show in the finished items. I've assumed the mould will be made with the seats face down, so the backs are the top of the poured resin level. This orientation, I hope, will allow the masters to be pulled from the mould fairly cleanly. Any undercuts have been minimised around the boxing in, and because the bases are totally enclosed I drilled breather holes at the back to allow solvent fumes to clear. These double as places for a screwdriver or tweezers to be inserted to lever the masters from the mould.

    I will assume some sanding will be required to finish the backs, but also for width. Without having constructed the carriages to the level where trial fitting could be done, I've gone on previous experience to gauge the final width.

    I'll be packing these up and shipping them off to Ian next week.
     
    Last edited: 13 February 2016
  8. unklian

    unklian Western Thunderer

    They look good Heather, and I am sure the mould orientation will work fine. You missed my comment about no hollow sections ! But don't worry I can get round it in this case and the holes you have drilled will help. Why ? well I do all my mould making ( and casting ) under vacuum and hollow bits can blow out or collapse if they are not vented in some way. I am looking forward to getting the masters anyway they look great .
     
  9. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    Would it be better if I block in under the armrests? I can still do that before I box them up.
     
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  10. unklian

    unklian Western Thunderer

    The arm rests are fine, they should fill and pop out easily with the way the mould will be orientated .
     
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  11. unklian

    unklian Western Thunderer

    Seat production has started .... RIMG4322.JPG
    Whoopee !!
     
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  12. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    I'd better get on with their future home!
     
  13. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    Our elderly puss has been occupying much of our time of late. Yesterday I couldn't refuse her use of my lap for the afternoon, as we really thought she wouldn't be with us by the end of the day. This morning, she's still with us, demanding attention, but I've managed to steal time at the bench.

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    Latch plates have gone on the E6 sides (top). The E3 (bottom) seems to follow a design with internal latch mechanisms, so that's a deal of soldering I don't need to do.

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    It was pretty obvious the hinge slots were intended to be filled with something a good deal larger than the CPL etched hinges on the kit. My solution to prevent things dropping through is to solder some shim brass on the rear.

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    After a serious amount of cussing and fiddle, I managed to work out how to fold and trim the etched hinges, and finally managed to get half of one side fitted out after what seems like days. What a fiddle they are, but worth it. I am reminded I ought to get some destination board brackets in.
     
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  14. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

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    A pretty full-on day later and the sum total of my efforts is two sides of the E6. The E3 has one extra compartment, so that will probably be another full day just to fit the hinges. I must be barking.
     
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  15. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    Today I fitted the hinges to the E3.

    I am now going to lie down in a darkened room to reassemble what's left of my sanity. :confused:
     
  16. David Varley

    David Varley Western Thunderer

    Are you unhinged??
     
  17. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    Wibble.
     
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  18. unklian

    unklian Western Thunderer

    The pile of seats is steadily getting bigger, and I think the timing might be right for a hand over at Railex. You did say you were going didn't you Heather ? What do you think ?


    RIMG4342.JPG
     
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  19. Heather Kay

    Heather Kay Western Thunderer

    *gulp*

    I will be at Railex, just not sure which day yet.

    Would now be a good time to say the client has added two more eight-wheelers to the list? Perhaps we ought to think of doubling the original order! :eek::thumbs:
     
  20. unklian

    unklian Western Thunderer

    I will be at Railex both days as I am helping Geraint Hughes with Obbekaer on stand 63.

    Have you not already doubled the order though ? I am aiming for 30 of each type at the moment :confused: At least I wont be doing the hinges :eek: