DCC The Secret World of Märklin

[TheSnapper]

This is a plea for help from any fellow WT’ers who may have some insight into the Secret World of Märklin and particulrly their MFX decoders.
I have a Gauge 1 Märklin BR38 loco fitted with a Märklin MFX decoder:



Also see here at a recent running session: http://www.westernthunder.co.uk/index.php?threads/german-modelling.4631/page-10
The loco runs fine using my NCE DCC system, and manual states that certain CV’s can be changed. However, I am finding it very frustrating that I can’t even change the address of the loco. I cannot read any CV’s using my controller or Decoder Pro, and any attempted changes cause the loco to become unresonsive, necessitating a CV8 reset (which thankfully works OK).
I am coming to the conclusion that unless I can conquer the beast, I would be better off replacing the decoder with a large Zimo (preferably) or a Loksound XL. I have approached both Zimo & ESU, but no-one appears to have any knowledge (or interest?) about doing this.
Removing the tender body to get at the electronics reveals this mass of non-colour-coded wiring:




The large black box is the speaker enclosure. The mass of black wires goes via a multi-pin connector to the loco. Presumably they include connections to & from the motor, lights & smoke unit(s).
HELP! I can’t find any detailed technical information on the Internet. Besides being able to define which wire goes where, what is the function of the separate PCB which fits on top of the lower board with multi-pin connectors? Is it the sound decoder?
I would like to know if anyone has any knowledge of these decoders/installations, or if you know of anyone who has!
Any information would be appreciated
Cheers
Tim

 

[Nigel Cliffe]

NCE's PowerPro system has a fairly low output on programming track, so that might be part of the issue. Have you tried other DCC programming devices ?

As for other makers, well, looking at the mass of black wiring, I don't blame them for lack of interest. First question on replacing the decoder is what type of motor is fitted to the loco - some Marklin motors are weird AC things with field coils and the like, so a standard DCC decoder for a DC motor doesn't work. Both ESU and Zimo have produced decoders suited to Marklin's AC motors.

 

[Steph Dale]

Tim,

One other thought might be to look at how much the Marklin Central Station (60213) would be. There are other routes to programming Marklin decoders (such as the Uhlenbrock Intellibox). If you're happy with the MFX decoders in the locos it would seem a credible option to me.

Steph

 

[Cliff Williams]

Can you take a picture of the chip with the prongs pointing upwards?
There is a PCB made by Demko Modellbahn that is used for wiring up Korean brass locos and you shove on the Zimo or Loksound chip with prongs, it then makes the connections.

I have retrofitted a Demko Ludmilla or two with ESU XLV4 chips and it was straightforward bar a minor alteration to prong length, this may be the same.

 

[TheSnapper]

Gentlemen - thanks for your replies:

Nigel – Yes, I should have thought of this, I’ll give it a try. Several times I have had to borrow my mate’s NCE Powercab (which was originally mine), in order to program large decoders. I bought the ProCab system thinking it to be a better option, but it does seem ridiculous that a cheaper device is able to perform better in some areas. I suppose I will have to buy another….
I’m not sure about the motor – that’s one of the frustrating things - I can’t find any detailed technical information. The only hint in the manual states: “The mode of operation (AC/DC, Mfx, Märklin Motorola, or DCC) is recognized automatically.”

Steph – thanks for the suggestion, but it looks like it might get a bit pricey, and I’m not sure I want to take on another system. Also, I think replacing the MFX decoder would probably give better control & sound. At least I’d feel a bit more comfortable with it!

Cliff – That sounds interesting. I am currently away from home, but will take a picture when I return. I presume you mean the prongs on the upper removable chip?
Do you have any more details or photos of the Demko Modellbahn PCB installation?
Thanks again

Tim

 

[Nigel Cliffe]

Tim,
it is possibly to purchase "programming track boosters" to up the power from the Power-Pro's programming output. However, if you're happy with DecoderPro, then perhaps a Sprog-3 would be the cheapest way to a more powerful stand-alone programmer.


- Nigel

 

[TheSnapper]

Hi All

Been on holiday for a couple of weeks, but since being back, I have purchased a Soundtraxx PTB-100 programming track booster as recommended by NCE here.

I can now read CV's and change them....but mostly with disastrous consequences, requiring a decoder reset.
For instance, the loco doesn't work if I change CV29 to anything but the default "39".
I cannot change the loco address, even using CV17 & 18 - the loco stops working.
I can alter CV's 3 & 4 OK

I am getting more convinced that I need to replace this strange decoder.

Cliff - here are photos of the PCB pins as requested:


I would appreciate any details of the Demko Modellbahn device you mentioned above

Cheers

Tim

 

[allegheny1600]

Hello Tim,
That is a very beautiful loco you have there!
I don't have any real knowledge of G1 (a bridge too far for me!) but I am fairly familiar with the H0 version and yes! Marklin/Trix MFX decoders can be somewhat problematic to program.
A friend of mine is conversant with binary code and had use this to change address of some of my locos for me. Subsequently I made the investment of an Uhlenbrock 'Intellibox', which I find to be a very impressive box of tricks. It also enables me to change MFX decoder addresses with ease!
So! You could do a one off investment in a new XL decoder or a s/h 'Intellibox' that can program any future decoders!
Also, it may be worth checking out German forums, I do use Große Spuren (Spur 0, 1, G) und Gartenbahn - Stummis Modellbahnforum, well not this section, the H0 section for me.
Simply cope this address into 'Google' "translate" and you should get a fair understanding of what is being discussed, even if the grammer comes out rather oddly.
Hope this helps,
John.

 

[TheSnapper]

Hi John
Thanks for your reply, and the link to Stummis Modellbahnforum.
I am now considering the Uhlenbrock 'Intellibox' as Steph suggested above, but would also be interested in the Demko Modellbahn PCB, mentioned by Cliff Williams in his post.
Regards
Tim

 

[TheSnapper]

Having thought about this further, even if I can program the decoder with an Uhlenbrock 'Intellibox', will it subsequently work on our NCE DCC systems?
After all, with the Soundtraxx PTB-100 programming track booster, I can now change CV's, but the loco will not run afterwards.
There's something really strange about this decoder.....I think I would prefer the replace it, and probably never buy another Märklin loco again.

Tim