Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Thanks Rob! I did try and recall your method, but had a brain fail.
I think your way would be better for longer coaches, too.
I think your way would be better for longer coaches, too.
On Heather's Workbench - going wide
- Thread starter Heather Kay
- Start date
Rob Pulham
Western Thunderer
I hear you on that one - there are so many tips and tricks posted it's hard to recall them when you need them - I have dozens bookmarked but then forget to look at my bookmarks
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
MRJ 28 is your friend here... the text describes how to convert the later style of Dean panelling / windows, as per the Slater's kit, into the style shown in your most recent photos.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
All the door hinges are now fitted, latch plates and the guard's lookouts in place on the V8.
I think the next stage ought to be fitting the roof. I plan to borrow Rob's idea of a scrap material cradle fitted to the roof panel which slots into the body. After than I can fit the partitions and blind all the door vents.
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
Heather,
What does the instructions say about bull's eye lenses in the sides of the guard's lookout? And about "chimneys" in the top of the lookout (against the cantrail)? The inclusion of lenses and chimneys - for an oil lamp under the top curve of the lookout - is something which is poorly documented in GWR Carriage histories... the only evidence for these seems to come with photographs of Guard's vehicles before WW1.
See here for what was done at Didcot.
What does the instructions say about bull's eye lenses in the sides of the guard's lookout? And about "chimneys" in the top of the lookout (against the cantrail)? The inclusion of lenses and chimneys - for an oil lamp under the top curve of the lookout - is something which is poorly documented in GWR Carriage histories... the only evidence for these seems to come with photographs of Guard's vehicles before WW1.
See here for what was done at Didcot.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Instructions? I don't understand.
Seriously, I have no instructions for this kit. I had the IKB booklet for the underframe, but as I built my own in the end it was set aside. I have been working from Russell's book (Part 1), gleaning details from photos and drawings and other people's models.
Here's an example of what I mean. The dog box obviously has a handle to open it. The sole photo of a V13, which has many of the same features of a V8, seems to show a grab handle and possibly a lock, whereas other brake van images show a T-handle. On balance, I shall probably go with the grab handle, which means I should fill the etched single hole and drill new ones.
Another thing I'm having difficulty with at the moment is the oil pot lighting. I have some rather nice cast brass pots to go on the roof, but photos show another panel or box associated with the fittings. I can't find a clear image to show me what it should look like at the moment, or what the extra boxes are for.
It's all part of the fun, I guess. We tend to be spoiled by modern kits having all this stuff laid on.
I just checked the V13 photo again (page 54, figure 56). It's a profile shot, but show no obvious evidence for a small chimney in the top of the lookout.
Seriously, I have no instructions for this kit. I had the IKB booklet for the underframe, but as I built my own in the end it was set aside. I have been working from Russell's book (Part 1), gleaning details from photos and drawings and other people's models.
Here's an example of what I mean. The dog box obviously has a handle to open it. The sole photo of a V13, which has many of the same features of a V8, seems to show a grab handle and possibly a lock, whereas other brake van images show a T-handle. On balance, I shall probably go with the grab handle, which means I should fill the etched single hole and drill new ones.
Another thing I'm having difficulty with at the moment is the oil pot lighting. I have some rather nice cast brass pots to go on the roof, but photos show another panel or box associated with the fittings. I can't find a clear image to show me what it should look like at the moment, or what the extra boxes are for.
It's all part of the fun, I guess. We tend to be spoiled by modern kits having all this stuff laid on.
I just checked the V13 photo again (page 54, figure 56). It's a profile shot, but show no obvious evidence for a small chimney in the top of the lookout.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Back on the broad gauge this weekend. What do you mean you don't work weekends? 
Anyway, it was time to fit the V8 with a roof. Suitable brass sheet had arrived, as had suitable tools missing from my arsenal, so I scribbled some measurements on a bit of paper and marked it all out on the shiny stuff.
All seemed well. I managed to get the curve rolled in fairly easily - happily it's not one of those pesky compound curves. I want to use a variant of Rob's roof cradle so the thing can be removed for painting, so I measured up a couple of inner ends. Realising I needed holes to suit where the end windows go, I also got some piercing saw practice in. I only broke one blade, which I count as a win.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, the roof was too short. Only a millimetre or so, but it refused to overhang the ends properly. I had to do it all over again… What's that saying about measuring thrice and cutting once? Yeah, that.
There's still a bit of a ripple down the edges, but I think I can sort that out with a little gentle persuasion.
It's looking a little too neat, so I must be doing something right at last!
Next up, sorting out the lamp tops. There is evidence for some sort of lid or pad that is just in front of the lamp top. I can't figure out what it's for, or how big it is. Best guess right now is it is a pad to stand the lamp on while it's being topped up with oil.
Now, as a test of the new forum software, let's see if the next image is the right way up!
Well it looks okay on this iPad. I will have to go fire up the desktop to check it looks okay on a proper browser. This is the simple inner clip ends, tack soldered for now. I'll add some bracing struts from scrap etch to make it more robust.
Anyway, it was time to fit the V8 with a roof. Suitable brass sheet had arrived, as had suitable tools missing from my arsenal, so I scribbled some measurements on a bit of paper and marked it all out on the shiny stuff.
All seemed well. I managed to get the curve rolled in fairly easily - happily it's not one of those pesky compound curves. I want to use a variant of Rob's roof cradle so the thing can be removed for painting, so I measured up a couple of inner ends. Realising I needed holes to suit where the end windows go, I also got some piercing saw practice in. I only broke one blade, which I count as a win.
Anyway, to cut a long story short, the roof was too short. Only a millimetre or so, but it refused to overhang the ends properly. I had to do it all over again… What's that saying about measuring thrice and cutting once? Yeah, that.
There's still a bit of a ripple down the edges, but I think I can sort that out with a little gentle persuasion.
It's looking a little too neat, so I must be doing something right at last!
Next up, sorting out the lamp tops. There is evidence for some sort of lid or pad that is just in front of the lamp top. I can't figure out what it's for, or how big it is. Best guess right now is it is a pad to stand the lamp on while it's being topped up with oil.
Now, as a test of the new forum software, let's see if the next image is the right way up!
Well it looks okay on this iPad. I will have to go fire up the desktop to check it looks okay on a proper browser. This is the simple inner clip ends, tack soldered for now. I'll add some bracing struts from scrap etch to make it more robust.
Last edited:
Mike Sheardown
Western Thunderer
That looks lovely Heather - I particularly like the safety chains, as they add an extra spark of detail to the model.
Cheers
Mike
Cheers
Mike
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Cheers Mike!
I'm pondering those pads I mentioned. It seems they are lamp plugs (function unclear), but I don't have any suitable parts in this collection of parts. That said, the S6 kit does have some castings - but they don't quite look like what I see in photos.
Now, before I contact the Broad Gauge Society stores to see if they can separately supply the parts packed in the S6, does anyone know of a supplier that can supply suitable bits?
I'm pondering those pads I mentioned. It seems they are lamp plugs (function unclear), but I don't have any suitable parts in this collection of parts. That said, the S6 kit does have some castings - but they don't quite look like what I see in photos.
Now, before I contact the Broad Gauge Society stores to see if they can separately supply the parts packed in the S6, does anyone know of a supplier that can supply suitable bits?
Overseer
Western Thunderer
Heather, I am not certain about the Great Western but on other railways the oil lamps were only put in the holders when needed. Circular low domed covers were provided for use when the lamps weren't in place and a circular ring was provided adjacent to the lamp hole to hold the covers when the lamps were in use. It is unlikely that the lamps would have been serviced or filled on the roof of carriages due to the danger and risk of fire. They would have been taken back to lamp rooms for refilling, wick trimming, chimney cleaning etc. The oil lamps would have been changed over when refilling was needed and wouldn't usually stay with the same carriage, although on a short branch line they probably would stay with the same stock and be serviced at one of the termini.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Ah, so the "lamp plugs" in the other kit represent the covers. As the client has been considering carriage lighting, I would be best served to source suitable covers like the S6.
Thanks Fraser!
Thanks Fraser!
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Ha! Finally got round to checking the photo in a desktop browser, and it's up the wrong way. I'll let Adrian know the system isn't reading the EXIF properly yet.
daifly
Western Thunderer
Heather, forgive a non-photographer but, by your own admission, you use your ipad inverted with the home key at the left so surely your top is everyone elses bottom etc. It is only to be expected that your photos have their top/bottom/left/right attributes set incorrectly. Try holding your posh still camera upside down. The output to a computer screen will appear inverted too. Not the EXIF data fault but the way the camera is held surely.
Standing by for a photograhy lesson!
Dave
Standing by for a photograhy lesson!
Dave
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Dave, you are probably quite correct. The home button orientation is more down to also having the "smart case". When in landscape mode, as now, with the machine on my lap, the cover is folded at the top propping the thing up slightly with the home button at left - and this has become the default way I handle it. This means the camera is bottom right.
I learned to flip the box 180 degrees so the camera is then top left, and this orientation seems to be the "correct" way up. I shall carry on doing that in the future, remembering to rotate any shots I take in the other direction by 360 degrees, which seems to fool the rest of the world into thinking the image is the right way up after all!
It's all good fun.
I learned to flip the box 180 degrees so the camera is then top left, and this orientation seems to be the "correct" way up. I shall carry on doing that in the future, remembering to rotate any shots I take in the other direction by 360 degrees, which seems to fool the rest of the world into thinking the image is the right way up after all!
It's all good fun.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Today I managed to get the S6 sides and ends assembled.
It all ended up reasonably square and true, which surprised me. The biggest hurdle with this type of kit is joining the corners up. I think what I'd like to ask kit designers is to add a bit of extra length to the sides, with a half-etched rebate for the end to sit in. I don't mind filing back excess material, but it's a lot of effort to get a good clean joint when there's no leeway.
Next on the agenda, I think, will be sorting out some interior partitions and a floor. I will use styrene sheet, because I'm currently fed up with wrangling brass!
It all ended up reasonably square and true, which surprised me. The biggest hurdle with this type of kit is joining the corners up. I think what I'd like to ask kit designers is to add a bit of extra length to the sides, with a half-etched rebate for the end to sit in. I don't mind filing back excess material, but it's a lot of effort to get a good clean joint when there's no leeway.
Next on the agenda, I think, will be sorting out some interior partitions and a floor. I will use styrene sheet, because I'm currently fed up with wrangling brass!
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
I have one! I am not sure how well the soft parts will cope with extended soldering iron proximity though.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Things progressing nicely on the S6 today.
Styrene sheet floor and compartment divisions, with Slater's coach seats (ref 7203). I am still pondering scribing planking for the divisions and floor.
I need to do a little research on the proper seat covering colours. I think I'm right in a dark marooney red.
Styrene sheet floor and compartment divisions, with Slater's coach seats (ref 7203). I am still pondering scribing planking for the divisions and floor.
I need to do a little research on the proper seat covering colours. I think I'm right in a dark marooney red.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
After this morning's burst of productivity I sort of ran out of puff. I did a bit of fettling on the PLV to make it run a little better.
First I rearranged to draw gear so the springing is shared between both hooks, in the centre of the coach underframe. I felt the "traditional" method of springing each hook might lead to odd forces tending to pull the coach off the rails, so springing from the centre may sort that out.
Next, I had a brainwave about the suspension. I had dutifully sprung the centre axle, but I found it was actually preventing some sideplay, and in turn causing derailments on the test track. As a test, I've removed the sprung wire from both sides, and running is now freer. I think now would be a good time to finish the test track so I can test properly.
First I rearranged to draw gear so the springing is shared between both hooks, in the centre of the coach underframe. I felt the "traditional" method of springing each hook might lead to odd forces tending to pull the coach off the rails, so springing from the centre may sort that out.
Next, I had a brainwave about the suspension. I had dutifully sprung the centre axle, but I found it was actually preventing some sideplay, and in turn causing derailments on the test track. As a test, I've removed the sprung wire from both sides, and running is now freer. I think now would be a good time to finish the test track so I can test properly.
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Today, mostly lamp brackets and sundry details needed before I think about beginning the painting process.
Like most of these coaches, detailed information is scant. The basics, however, seem to have been in pretty much constant use until the end of the Dean period, so educated guesses can be made. Since the vacuum brake, which was retrofitted at some point after the original build date, seems to have stayed on the same side of the vehicle (usually the same side as the brake cylinder), the number of lower end lamp brackets seems to vary. Some places say two brackets, but if there's a brake stand it looks like the affected bracket was removed. This is what I've done.
The same sort of thing done to the S6. Oddly, this kit failed to include etched end steps, so I raided the currently pending V13 PLV. I'll source replacements for that from CPL later.
I've also spent a while cleaning things up. I used a combination of scratch brushes and brass whizzy-wheel, which is why it looks all shiny. I think a scrub with Viakal, then leaving things to dry in the airing cupboard will round off today's efforts. I suppose it's time to think about getting some etch primer sprayed about.
Like most of these coaches, detailed information is scant. The basics, however, seem to have been in pretty much constant use until the end of the Dean period, so educated guesses can be made. Since the vacuum brake, which was retrofitted at some point after the original build date, seems to have stayed on the same side of the vehicle (usually the same side as the brake cylinder), the number of lower end lamp brackets seems to vary. Some places say two brackets, but if there's a brake stand it looks like the affected bracket was removed. This is what I've done.
The same sort of thing done to the S6. Oddly, this kit failed to include etched end steps, so I raided the currently pending V13 PLV. I'll source replacements for that from CPL later.
I've also spent a while cleaning things up. I used a combination of scratch brushes and brass whizzy-wheel, which is why it looks all shiny. I think a scrub with Viakal, then leaving things to dry in the airing cupboard will round off today's efforts. I suppose it's time to think about getting some etch primer sprayed about.