Bible For British Track

[BrushType4]

.........and how about this Phil...View attachment 10699note the flat bottom on the main line is fishplated lengths of rail, with bullhead in the sidings.
Why do you say you might have to foget the flat bottom rail mate. atb, Col.

I don't want to forget the flat bottom rail, but I assume I cant get the chairs? Ideally I'd like to model concrete sleepers too!

 

[Eastsidepilot]

I don't want to forget the flat bottom rail, but I assume I cant get the chairs? Ideally I'd like to model concrete sleepers too!

Peco used to do parts, I'm sure, but this may be of interest http://www.mmrs.co.uk/technical/track.html
certainly concrete sleepers need investigating in model form

ATB, Col

 

[Dog Star]

Sidings in the 1970s is the real tricky one to decide:- timber rather than concrete sleepers.... bullhead more likely than flat-bottom.... rail lengths to late pre-group or early post-group lengths rather than late-group / BR standard of 60' (note that 60' might still be accurate if that was the standard circa 1925-30).... if BH rail then oak keys more likely than mills spring clips... if FB then most likely to be pandrol in baseplates.

What you need to decide here is the possibility / probability that the sidings are as laid by the pre-group company or re-laid by the post-group company using pre-group materials.

Of course you can do what you wish... just decide on a history that supports your likes / dislikes.

 

[Dog Star]

Corby, 1976....note the flat bottom on the main line is fishplated lengths of rail, with bullhead in the sidings.

Just goes to prove that anything is possible.... try counting the sleepers per rail length in the sidings. There is a mixture of 60' rails with 22 sleepers per length and 30' rails with 10 / 11 sleepers per length. My recent studies of LNWR track in the 1930s produced too many instances of 60' rails with 20, 22 and 23 sleepers per rail length to be a co-incidence. So what ever the HMRS says about the LNWR PW... the photographic evidence suggests that the LNWR relaid some sections by replacing 30' rails with 60' rails and retaining the sleepers as is - hence 60' track with 22 sleepers per rail length is probably using the sleeper bed from two consecutive panels of 30' rails with 11 sleepers per rail length - and I bet that the LNWR did not replace the outer sleepers with the expected 12" wide joint sleeper.

regards, Graham

 

[BrushType4]

Sidings in the 1970s is the real tricky one to decide:- timber rather than concrete sleepers.... bullhead more likely than flat-bottom.... rail lengths to late pre-group or early post-group lengths rather than late-group / BR standard of 60' (note that 60' might still be accurate if that was the standard circa 1925-30).... if BH rail then oak keys more likely than mills spring clips... if FB then most likely to be pandrol in baseplates.

What you need to decide here is the possibility / probability that the sidings are as laid by the pre-group company or re-laid by the post-group company using pre-group materials.

Of course you can do what you wish... just decide on a history that supports your likes / dislikes.

Sidings would be all original or parts on wooden sleepers. A small section around the 'new' circa 1970 diesel facilities is flat bottom and pandrol baseplates. I can live without concrete sleepers.

To the best of my knowledge pandrol baseplates are not available as parts for self build track. Hopefully someone will say I'm wrong

 

[BrushType4]

Just goes to prove that anything is possible.... try counting the sleepers per rail length in the sidings. There is a mixture of 60' rails with 22 sleepers per length and 30' rails with 10 / 11 sleepers per length. My recent studies of LNWR track in the 1930s produced too many instances of 60' rails with 20, 22 and 23 sleepers per rail length to be a co-incidence. So what ever the HMRS says about the LNWR PW... the photographic evidence suggests that the LNWR relaid some sections by replacing 30' rails with 60' rails and retaining the sleepers as is - hence 60' track with 22 sleepers per rail length is probably using the sleeper bed from two consecutive panels of 30' rails with 11 sleepers per rail length - and I bet that the LNWR did not replace the outer sleepers with the expected 12" wide joint sleeper.

regards, Graham

Sounds like i could make it up as I go along

 

[Dog Star]

Sounds like i could make it up as I go along

You can try.... there are enough of us here who like a good bit of PW (and probably keen enough to offer advice as to what works with what.... after you have built some).

If you keep FB / concrete / 60' rails for those sidings nearest the main line and BH / wooden / 30'.... 45'....60.... for the boon docks then you will be heading in the correct direction. Turnouts in the sidings are going to be on 12" timbering and probably BH rather than FB.... certainly no cast crossings!

You need to look at what Peco has available in the Individulay range of parts.

How about FB on baseplates (resin as per Cynric's current adventure) held down by elastic spikes? (C&L has offered dog spikes in the past)

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Phil, try the Peco web site, looks like they list pandrol clips for code 143 flat bottom rail plus other bits and pieces.

ATB,Col.

 

[28ten]

I don't want to forget the flat bottom rail, but I assume I cant get the chairs? Ideally I'd like to model concrete sleepers too!

I dont know about the availability of concrete sleepers, but if someone chucked a drawing my way.... im confident that you could resin cast it from a printed master.

 

[Eastsidepilot]

I dont know about the availability of concrete sleepers, but if someone chucked a drawing my way.... im confident that you could resin cast it from a printed master.

You'd need some specials for point work also

ATB, Col.

 

[Dog Star]

You'd need some specials for point work also

ATB, Col.

I do hope that you are not recommending concrete for turnout timbers (bet that is not the correct term in current PW speak).... I think that wood was the preferred material for turnouts until the 1990s.

regards, Graham

 

[28ten]

You'd need some specials for point work also

ATB, Col.

They are still pretty easy its just a rectangle with a few lumps knocked off and a bit of lettering

 

[Eastsidepilot]

I do hope that you are not recommending concrete for turnout timbers (bet that is not the correct term in current PW speak).... I think that wood was the preferred material for turnouts until the 1990s.
regards, Graham

I was assuming the guys modelling the current scene, meaning the last 20 years, would be interested, not my bag of coarse give me timber any day Graham , could be a seller though?.

Col.

 

[28ten]

I really need to try and get a copy, what's the going rate for an edition from the 30's/40's ?

 

[Eastsidepilot]

I really need to try and get a copy, what's the going rate for an edition from the 30's/40's ?

Guv'
Not sure about the going rate, I have seen them going for silly money, around £80.00 but John got one for a tenner back in post #11.
I got mine cheap some years back, but the guy didn't know what he had.

ATB, Col.

 

[D G Williams]

Coming in abit to this discussion, I'm afraid. My copy of the Permanent Way Institute's 'British Railway Track' is the 3rd edition, 1964. The first edition was in 1943 and the second was 1956.
Another useful book is 'A Handy Platelayer's Guide' published by Thomas Summerson & Sons of Darlington in 1895. It provides data for points but not slips in eight gauges from 18 inches to standard. Somerson's were makers of track components and were contractors for putting in sidings etc. Worth loking for, I think. I got my copy from seconhand bookshop in Birmingham that is alas long gone.
Bull head track can still be seen at Birmingham's New Street station! Judging by its appearance I don't think any of it has been used for a very long time and, if I remember rightly, the point connecting the Stourbridge Town branch to the main line is also still bull head.
Regards to all, David.