Jigs And Gauges For Track Making

[Dog Star]

I would like to make this jig for 60' rails, but what is the measurements of the spacers between the sleepers? also does anybody make this jig as I have no way of doing this?

Hello Len,

I am not sure which jig is the object of your enquiry... a jig for assembling track or a jig for cutting rails. That you mention the spacing of sleepers suggests that you are interested in the track assembly jig and I shall reply accordingly.

The track jig that I have made for 60' rails is for LNWR track circa 1900 and hence the sleeper spacing is that for the LNWR... there is a drawing of a LNWR 60' track panel in the "LNWR Liveries" book from the HMRS. Other railway companies used 60' rails, as did British Railways, and hence there are variations in the numbers of sleepers per rail length / spacing between sleepers. I can provide the LNWR info.... I do not have any info for later track details (although I suspect that users of Templot might be able to assist).

The track jigs that I make use wood sections that are to be found in most garages (at least garages of those who confess to some level of DIY experience.... yes, yes, those at the back of the class can claim that they practice DIM instead). I make the jigs whilst modelling on the dining room table and the tools are nothing more fussy than a tenon saw (to cut the chipboard/MDF/pine to length), a Stanley knife (to cut the 1.6mm ply into strips) and a steel ruler. Having the sleepers to hand is helpful in getting the spacers cut to the correct width (sand the edges of the spacers for a sliding fit).

Otherwise, nothing tricky, just ensure that glue is kept out of the sleeper slots.

regards, Graham

 

[Len Cattley]

Thanks Graham, it will LMS/BR I have Templot and they show 60' 25 sleepers 10" width. I have some Walnut from S7 but find they are a bit wider (6.02-05) instead of 5.84 do I use them or make my own? I have measured the space between the sleepers as being 11.13 so I will using that. I like the look of your jig so will try and make one for me.

Len

 

[Dog Star]

I have some Walnut from S7 but find they are a bit wider (6.02-05) instead of 5.84 do I use them or make my own?

I have been supplied with several thousand walnut sleepers for Hartley Hill and that stock exhibits the same attribute as yours - variable width. I did a rough sort of the stock into those at or around 10" scale width and those which are greater than 10" scale width - the sleepers which are close to a scale 10" width have been used for the 60' track panels (LNWR circa 1900, between 20 and 24 per rail length with 12" wide sleepers adjacent to the rail joint) whilst those which are, as you say, a tad over 6mm in width have been used for the 30' track panels (LNWR circa 1890s, 10 sleepers per rail length). So by splitting the sleepers into two piles I have been able to produce 30' and 60' jigs with sleeper slots of widths appropriate to the intended sleepers.

As you have mentioned the matter of sleeper width it is worth noting that the thickness is not consistent across supplies with the greatest variability being with the 12" and 14" wide strips for use in turnouts. I have had to sand the top surface of turnout timbers after gluing the timbers to the foundation so as to achieve a decent top before proceeding with the rails.

Where I have a choice or can influence the selection of materials I recommend 1.6mm birch ply for sleepers / timbers.

regards, Graham

 

[Dog Star]

... I have Templot and they show 60' 25 sleepers 10" width. ... I have measured the space between the sleepers as being 11.13mm,

Whilst I would like to say that I set out to make the spacers of a specific width as per prototype I recognise that there is a more pragmatic way to achieve the result.

1/ Fix the end pine members at 420mm apart (7mm scale for 60') and then stick the two outermost spacers in place (ok - you have to calculate this measurement and you can cheat if you wish by producing a number which is easy to measure).

2/ Measure the distance between the inner edges of the two outer spacers, call this "MAX_WIDTH".

3/ Calculate the width of all of the sleepers to be held in the jig, call this "TOT_SLEEPERS".

3/ Calculate how much "space" is available for the total width of spacers, call this "TOT_SPACERS" and obtained by subtracting "TOT_SLEEPERS" from "MAX_WIDTH".

4/ Divide the space available for the spacers by the number of spacers required for the jig - this number is one less than the number of sleepers because the two outermost spacers have been glued in place previously - call this "SPACER WIDTH".

Now cut your spacer material into a long strip of width "SPACER_WIDTH" .... I measure the width of the strip at both ends and sand as required. Cut the strip into individual spacers.

In the original post I included a photo of the jig containing sleepers and spacers before gluing the spacers in place... this approach allows one to feel how tight the fit of sleepers and adjust spacers to suit.

regards, Graham.

 

[Len Cattley]

Hi Graham, I think that is the best method of calculating the distance between sleepers with the ones I have. If I get any more I will shave each sleeper with a sanding disc so I get the same width. I have some chairs from C&L but do not know if they are right or left chairs can you tell me?

Len

 

[richard carr]

Len

Do recognise that on a 60ft track panel the sleeper spacing is not even, the ones at the end are generally closer together.

Richard

 

[Len Cattley]

Thanks Richard I've noticed that on the Templot plan I have, do you know what chairs I have. I have noticed your track layout would love to see it sometime if possible?

Len

 

[Dog Star]

I have some chairs from C&L but do not know if they are right or left chairs can you tell me?

The chair on the left has the key driven from the right and the chair on the right has the key driven from the left. As plain line chairs are generally not handed then the direction in which the key is driven determines how the chair is used. For level track where the direction of travel is predominately in one direction, arrange the chairs so that the key is driven from the side facing towards on-coming traffic. So for normal double track arrange the chairs so that the keys are driven in the same direction as the engine is travelling.

Do recognise that on a 60ft track panel the sleeper spacing is not even, the ones at the end are generally closer together.

What Richard says is true for the majority of companies - so to accomodate this variance you need to add in the relevant spacer(s) during step 1/ above.

 

[Dog Star]

...do you know what chairs I have?...

Those chairs look like four hole plain line chairs, often referred to as type "S1".

 

[richard carr]

Graham you may be right bu those chairs look like LNER 3 bolt to me could we see the other side please Len.

I will let you know the next time we have running day

Thanks

 

[Len Cattley]

Hi Richard they are 3 bolt and I they are supposed to be for the LMS might also be for the LNER too.

Len

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Guy's you might find this of interest, sorry for the hi-jack Dogstar
It's from the British Railway Track book published by the Permanent Way Institution, 1964 edition, so B.R.


Col

 

[richard carr]

Len

they are 3 bolt LNER chairs as sold by the original C&L.

Richard

 

[Len Cattley]

bought the wrong ones.

Len

 

[OzzyO]

bought the wrong ones.

Len

Hello Len,

I've just had a quick look on the C&L web site and they only do one type of three bolt chair. LMS, LNER and BR.

Also some railway Cos. used a 12" sleeper as the first sleeper in a track panel. But I think that went out of use in the 1930s.

OzzyO.

 

[Len Cattley]

Hi OzzyO, I thought I bought the right ones, here is the track (without ballast) I just need to add that and weather it.
Sorry for taking your thread Dog star

Len

 

[S-Club-7]

Also some railway Cos. used a 12" sleeper as the first sleeper in a track panel. But I think that went out of use in the 1930s.

And probably also had a wider S1J joint chair on the wider 12" timber to provide more support for the join.

Available from Off The Rails

 

[Dog Star]

The LNWR and the GER had special "joint chairs". In the case of the LNWR the special chair was wider than the standard plain line chair - and no, I have not yet made any joint chairs for Hartley Hill... narrowing chairs for use in pre-1900 turnouts is one thing, I have drawn the line at splitting a standard chair and inserting a 20-30th strip to produce a joint chair

 

[ZiderHead]

Do recognise that on a 60ft track panel the sleeper spacing is not even, the ones at the end are generally closer together.

This photo taken near Poole in 1982 shows the spacing at the end of a BR 60' panel really nicely: