Paint, Any good?

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
The wagon was acquired secondhand from an individual who perhaps didn't take quite as much care as possible, the plain steel, axles, wheels, screws were so badly rusted as to be not reusable and some of the plastic mouldings were detaching where the glued joint had failed. All the replacement bits have been purchased but the underneath of the body requires repainting to hide the horrors. The tin of paint is unopened but very old, certainly there are fluid contents and no doubt a good stir will make it look like liquid paint but am I taking a chance in using it? I appreciate that the best anyone can do is an informed opinion, but it all helps.
Martin
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Dog Star

Western Thunderer
Wow, a can of the original (?) from when that company occupied a corridor plus room or two of a church , sharing the property with the Dean-Clark dance school.

regards, Graham
 

Yorkshire Dave

Western Thunderer
If the wagon underframe is going to be weathered, personally I'd use an acrylic burnt umber or the closest to SR brown rather than open a tin for a single use. Especially as it's underneath and you're not going to see it.
 

Overseer

Western Thunderer
I have similar age Precision Paints tins still in use, some have been opened and then stored upside down - still good. Unopened tins that have liquid in them will be fine to use provided they are stirred well. I find stirring well then reseal for a few hours then stir again before use works well.
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Right, I have this tin of paint that didn't directly cost me anything which will probably be ok, which is the right colour and I might as well use, at my stage in life the number of vehicles needing a touch of SR brown is pretty limited. A small tin from Precision will cost me £9.50 to get on the bench, I'll stir it well. Pic to follow when done.
Martin
 

AJC

Western Thunderer
As Fraser says, it should be fine following a good hard stir. Dad has some of this sort of vintage (or at least, he did last time I rummaged through his paint stocks) and that went on just fine last I saw.

Adam
 

Tim V

Western Thunderer
I'm a bit concerned that a tin of Precision Paint is regarded as 'vintage'.

I've got several tins of this stuff, must stick it on eBay - 'Barn Find' 'Vintage' - I might make a fortune!
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Graham probably has an idea of how old it is, several decades I think. They have newer stuff than this in the Antiques Roadshow so I guess vintage is an apt description.
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
It turned out the tin had been opened in the past and was about a third used, however the solids all mixed in well, it could probably have benefited from a drop of thinners. It was spread liberally around the underneath of the wagon in a vaguely artistic manner, Warren need not be at all concerned and is drying overnight. It will do adequately enough and looks better than what was there. I am no painter!
Martin
 

Chas Levin

Western Thunderer
One thing I don't understand is why thre should be such variation between tins from the same manufacturer and form around the same date. I've found this with both Phoenix PRecision and Humbrol; I should have thought that the bulk manufacturing process was sufficiently standardised as to rule out some tins being usable and some not and, even more frustratingly, some lasting for years after opening (such as your one there, Martin) and some drying out only moths after first use.
Presumably it means that no matter what date and batch codes are stamped on the tin, there must have been some variation at the time of manufacture, musn't there?
 

Overseer

Western Thunderer
One thing I don't understand is why thre should be such variation between tins from the same manufacturer and form around the same date. I've found this with both Phoenix PRecision and Humbrol; I should have thought that the bulk manufacturing process was sufficiently standardised as to rule out some tins being usable and some not and, even more frustratingly, some lasting for years after opening (such as your one there, Martin) and some drying out only moths after first use.
Presumably it means that no matter what date and batch codes are stamped on the tin, there must have been some variation at the time of manufacture, musn't there?
Traditional pigments were minerals found with the colour wanted or treated with heat or other processes to produce coloured oxides or carbonates. Simplistically, the different pigments have differing chemical reactions with the gums and solvents used in the paint so the different colours could remain useable for different lengths of time depending whether the pigments are inert or reactive.

The other factor for useable life of opened tins is whether contaminants have been introduced. Adding some solvents to Humbrol will make it solidify in weeks. I never add anything to the tins to avoid problems.
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Yes, apologies for the tortured English, I'm sure you understood being the erudite soul you are. You have reminded me to post an "after" pic, thanks.
Martin
 

MoatLane

Western Thunderer
I have some tins of Precision Paints bought at Home of O Gauge when I changed to 7mm modelling in the mid-1980s, still in good condition after nearly 40 years.
 

Chas Levin

Western Thunderer
Traditional pigments were minerals found with the colour wanted or treated with heat or other processes to produce coloured oxides or carbonates. Simplistically, the different pigments have differing chemical reactions with the gums and solvents used in the paint so the different colours could remain useable for different lengths of time depending whether the pigments are inert or reactive.
Yes, that makes perfect sense of course, but I think you're talking about different usable times for different colours: I'm talking about a situation where I have two tins of the same colour, from the same manufacturer, bought at the same time and bearing markings apparently indicating tey're from the same batch, but which exhibit very differnet usability times. I've found this out because I tend to buy two or more tinlets at the same time for a project, to guard against the possibility of running out before the prject is finished and, in buying further paint weeks or even months late, finding slight batch colour variations. That's what puzzles me: tins of the same colour, from the same batch, with varying lifetimes...

The other factor for useable life of opened tins is whether contaminants have been introduced. Adding some solvents to Humbrol will make it solidify in weeks. I never add anything to the tins to avoid problems.

That's something I'm awar eof too, from talking to Phoenix Precision and from reading Ian Rathbone's 'Painting & Lining' book, so I never mix or add anything in the paint's own tin, I always decant a small amount (using a cleaning metal implement) and mix or add in another receptacle. I collect plastic bottle and yoghurt or dessert tops for this purpose, as they're easily cleaned, used once to mix a small amount of paint and then trown away.
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
As much for general interest than to demonstrate my less than average painting,
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the underside of the wagon with two coats, brush marks and stray hairs at no extra cost. The colour match to the underside of the floor planks isn't perfect but will do, certainly perfectly adequate for trundling around the garden. Another problem has shown itself, the W iron/axlebox castinb locates on the inner pair of holes and is held in place by self tapping screws. These are great for a one off operation into sheet metal but aren't brilliant for repaeted useage in injection moulded plastic. The solebar is hollow so the plan is to drill out the holes to 2.5mm, fill as far as poss with tamped down Milliput and then drill and refix. I could epoxy the castings in place which will see me but it would restrict changing the wheels between the commonly used gauges which I would rather not do.
Regards
Martin
 
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