PMV races
- Thread starter Simon
- Start date
jamiepage
Western Thunderer
Hmm. An afternoon of two halves today. Good fun pushing the G3 loco chassis about but the plastic PMV didn't go so well.
Put the transfers on last night but they weren't particularly convincing with curled edges and blooming. I hadn't used waterslide transfers for a great many years and had a nagging doubt the body paint was too matt as I was putting them on but didn't have the intelligence to stop.
Left it overnight and thought a quick blast of matt varnish might bed it all down. Blind wishful thinking, and it didn't help at all. The varnish was an acrylic so I think the only thing to do is leave it a week, then carefully rub down the whole body panel to get rid of varnish and transfers, paint with gloss and try again.
Bit of a pain really, especially as 1409 was the only option on the transfer sheet for a green job so the next attempt will need some splicing as well.
Put the transfers on last night but they weren't particularly convincing with curled edges and blooming. I hadn't used waterslide transfers for a great many years and had a nagging doubt the body paint was too matt as I was putting them on but didn't have the intelligence to stop.
Left it overnight and thought a quick blast of matt varnish might bed it all down. Blind wishful thinking, and it didn't help at all. The varnish was an acrylic so I think the only thing to do is leave it a week, then carefully rub down the whole body panel to get rid of varnish and transfers, paint with gloss and try again.
Bit of a pain really, especially as 1409 was the only option on the transfer sheet for a green job so the next attempt will need some splicing as well.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
You need to apply Pledge Klear clear first, this will give a smooth finish to the matt surface which will stop the 'silvering' of the decal, once both are dry then spray matt varnish over both and you'll barely see the join.
Pledge klear clear is actually a water based floor polish which used to be Johnsons crystal clear, though the new formula still works very well apparently, once set it's pretty impervious to most things.
As an aside my mate who modelled 15mm war-gaming put me onto it years ago (20+) he got it from when he served in the tank corps, Squaddies used to try and add it to their boots to make them shine for inspection....rather than hours of polish....though his Sargent got wise and used to walk around with a pipette of warm water and some other solution (they thought it might be lemon juice) apply a little drop to each boot toe, if it turned milky white you were in deep
I believe Micro Sol also do a solution to apply over matt surfaces to stop decal silvering. All this is very common in military modelling, in some respects, military modellers are streets ahead of us railway modellers in tools, techniques and ideas.
The other way around this is to always spray in gloss, apply your decals and then spray a clear matt finish over the top.
Pledge klear clear is actually a water based floor polish which used to be Johnsons crystal clear, though the new formula still works very well apparently, once set it's pretty impervious to most things.
As an aside my mate who modelled 15mm war-gaming put me onto it years ago (20+) he got it from when he served in the tank corps, Squaddies used to try and add it to their boots to make them shine for inspection....rather than hours of polish....though his Sargent got wise and used to walk around with a pipette of warm water and some other solution (they thought it might be lemon juice) apply a little drop to each boot toe, if it turned milky white you were in deep
I believe Micro Sol also do a solution to apply over matt surfaces to stop decal silvering. All this is very common in military modelling, in some respects, military modellers are streets ahead of us railway modellers in tools, techniques and ideas.
The other way around this is to always spray in gloss, apply your decals and then spray a clear matt finish over the top.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
Addresses what?, if you can get the decal off in one piece, preserve it somewhere for reuse and then apply Klear it should all work tickity boo. You may also like to look at Micro Sol setting solution, this makes the decal carrier film very soft and allows it to form over small details like rivets and panel lines etc, but it won't cope with matt surfaces in my experience. If you cannot get the decal off to save , then try to get it off without damaging the paint surface, then apply Klear and a new decal.
If the surface is really matt and I mean quite rough to the touch then apply a couple of layers of Klear with a small fine broad brush, let the first layer dry for several hours, even though it's water based, once dry it's pretty hard wearing.
Best bet is to spray a sample piece of plasticard with the same paint, apply Klear, apply random unwanted decal and see how it goes....before doing the real deal. Once it's on then you'll need a fine layer of matt varnish to blend it in, weathering also helps, but usually the varnish covers most of the joins, especially if you've used Micro Sol Set to soften the decal at the edges.
If you want to explore this further then just Google 1:35 military decal application or some such combination, there are many others but I've always found 1:35 to be the most popular scale. But, be prepared to loose a lot of time down rabbit holes and come back totally disheartened LOL, there's some seriously good modelling out there irrespective of subject matter
If the surface is really matt and I mean quite rough to the touch then apply a couple of layers of Klear with a small fine broad brush, let the first layer dry for several hours, even though it's water based, once dry it's pretty hard wearing.
Best bet is to spray a sample piece of plasticard with the same paint, apply Klear, apply random unwanted decal and see how it goes....before doing the real deal. Once it's on then you'll need a fine layer of matt varnish to blend it in, weathering also helps, but usually the varnish covers most of the joins, especially if you've used Micro Sol Set to soften the decal at the edges.
If you want to explore this further then just Google 1:35 military decal application or some such combination, there are many others but I've always found 1:35 to be the most popular scale. But, be prepared to loose a lot of time down rabbit holes and come back totally disheartened LOL, there's some seriously good modelling out there irrespective of subject matter
graham thorp
Member
Hi Jamie.
Sorry to see your decals have silvered so badly. Personally I would use a proper Gloss Varnish to prepare the surface for decals - after the decal has set and dried you then airbrush it with Matt Varnish to seal and blend with the surrounding paintwork.
My cousin uses Johnsons Klear but this trick is usually reserved for dipping clear aircraft cockpit canopies in to produce a uniform, glassy appearance and to remove any fine scratches and imperfections.
I found this site for you as they make custom decals and they look really good so you could ask them to reprint what you have lost.
http://www.flightlinegraphics.com/waterslides/about.waterslides.htm
Looking forward to seeing the perfected result.
Best. G
Sorry to see your decals have silvered so badly. Personally I would use a proper Gloss Varnish to prepare the surface for decals - after the decal has set and dried you then airbrush it with Matt Varnish to seal and blend with the surrounding paintwork.
My cousin uses Johnsons Klear but this trick is usually reserved for dipping clear aircraft cockpit canopies in to produce a uniform, glassy appearance and to remove any fine scratches and imperfections.
I found this site for you as they make custom decals and they look really good so you could ask them to reprint what you have lost.
http://www.flightlinegraphics.com/waterslides/about.waterslides.htm
Looking forward to seeing the perfected result.
Best. G
jamiepage
Western Thunderer
Grahem,
Thank you for your reply. I will I think, unless Mickoo tells me I have the wrong stuff, give the Pledge a go first. If only to make some sense to my wife just why I have been encouraged by WT to find some.
The link was very interesting, thank you. I have a couple of jobs to send them.
Yours
Jamie
Thank you for your reply. I will I think, unless Mickoo tells me I have the wrong stuff, give the Pledge a go first. If only to make some sense to my wife just why I have been encouraged by WT to find some.
The link was very interesting, thank you. I have a couple of jobs to send them.
Yours
Jamie
graham thorp
Member
Hi Jamie.
Yes, the link to the decal printer was very good. Did you read through about how they layer the colours to make each design? Fab stuff and they looked great quality as well....... now I need a project myself that needs custom decals!
Best.
G
Yes, the link to the decal printer was very good. Did you read through about how they layer the colours to make each design? Fab stuff and they looked great quality as well....... now I need a project myself that needs custom decals!
Best.
G
jamiepage
Western Thunderer
It's almost too embarrassing, but even with the finishing line in sight I'm still stalled at the final hurdle. Falling over, dusting off, and falling over again.
I have now exhausted the three possible transfer options for the Bulleid PMV from the sheet I purchased, so have now prepared the model for the fourth time and await a new set of transfers from CCT.
I hasten to add there is nothing whatsoever intrinsically wrong with the transfers; all own goals - the first attempt was on a matt finish, the second followed Pledging- better, but I should have used two coats. The third suffered from some kind of interaction between who knows what layers of paint/ pledge/ varnish.
So the relevant body panel has been rubbed back to virgin plastic, and will be GLOSS painted in the hiatus before the second sheet arrives.
In the meantime however, and this is really the reason for posting, the rest of CCT sheet BL97 is now redundant to me, so I am happy to send it on to the builder of the next WT PMV when they are ready, if they would similarly pass it on in due course.
I have now exhausted the three possible transfer options for the Bulleid PMV from the sheet I purchased, so have now prepared the model for the fourth time and await a new set of transfers from CCT.
I hasten to add there is nothing whatsoever intrinsically wrong with the transfers; all own goals - the first attempt was on a matt finish, the second followed Pledging- better, but I should have used two coats. The third suffered from some kind of interaction between who knows what layers of paint/ pledge/ varnish.
So the relevant body panel has been rubbed back to virgin plastic, and will be GLOSS painted in the hiatus before the second sheet arrives.
In the meantime however, and this is really the reason for posting, the rest of CCT sheet BL97 is now redundant to me, so I am happy to send it on to the builder of the next WT PMV when they are ready, if they would similarly pass it on in due course.
jamiepage
Western Thunderer
If you'll forgive a quick snap, with the exception of axlebox keeps and paint around the 'boxes themselves the plastic job is just about done and ready for weathering. The finishing, both paint and transfers, has been frustrating and definitely not something I'm good at. Apart from anything else, far too much paint has dulled the reasonably sharp louvred door panels to the point where I probably needn't have bothered.
Overall it's been fun but I enjoyed the building rather more than the finishing.
On to weathering. The originals were turned out with pre- coloured black plastic body panels so I'm assuming the roof at least would have weathered to a washed out grey, and the green painted sides may have suffered from the paint sticking less tenaciously to the plastic panels but more so to the metal framing. Both these ideas will give me plenty of opportunity to mess up the weathering.
Overall it's been fun but I enjoyed the building rather more than the finishing.
On to weathering. The originals were turned out with pre- coloured black plastic body panels so I'm assuming the roof at least would have weathered to a washed out grey, and the green painted sides may have suffered from the paint sticking less tenaciously to the plastic panels but more so to the metal framing. Both these ideas will give me plenty of opportunity to mess up the weathering.
jamiepage
Western Thunderer
Well, it's still not finished so it could be a while yet.
And it was an easier project, plastic and all, so I feel more like one of those irritating spectators running alongside while the proper race is going on with the contestants on track.
Anyway, I took it out for a quick photo or two in the evening sun- which is as close to gardening as I hope to get this weekend. The second photo shows the transfers STILL not looking right, although to be honest it is less offensive 'in the flesh', the 'silvering' this time being caused by variations in the base paint rather than the transfer panel itself . A dusting of weathering should bed it down, but it will have to be good enough this time though, because there is just absolutely no enthusiasm left for another go.
And it was an easier project, plastic and all, so I feel more like one of those irritating spectators running alongside while the proper race is going on with the contestants on track.
Anyway, I took it out for a quick photo or two in the evening sun- which is as close to gardening as I hope to get this weekend. The second photo shows the transfers STILL not looking right, although to be honest it is less offensive 'in the flesh', the 'silvering' this time being caused by variations in the base paint rather than the transfer panel itself . A dusting of weathering should bed it down, but it will have to be good enough this time though, because there is just absolutely no enthusiasm left for another go.
D816Foxhound
Western Thunderer
Jamie,
It certainly looks very nice in the sunlight. I wish my own painting efforts were this far advanced!
Roger
It certainly looks very nice in the sunlight. I wish my own painting efforts were this far advanced!
Roger