7mm PW in the industrial world (in the Forest of Dean)

Discussion in 'Permanent Way' started by Dog Star, 9 June 2021.

  1. Dog Star

    Dog Star Western Thunderer

    Jordan (@Jordan),

    Clearly you have been keeping up with the development of and research for Scruft's Jcn..

    Speech House Road had 45' track panels with concrete pots up to the end - I have made several lengths of such track for Ian's (@Ian Pope) model of that station and the track towards Wimberry.

    Given that Scruft's runs services in the Edwardian period and in the last few years of Pannier operation then concrete pots are not going to happen as such would be an anachronism.

    regards, Graham
  2. AJC

    AJC Western Thunderer

    I don't think such things had come about in the early 1900s, though they make attractive things to model (and I have). I was looking for something completely different, earlier and came across an example of Barlow rail in situ and in use in the 1920s (in a private siding off the Chard branch, GW flavour). It's ballasted to sleeper top level so it isn't clear whether it's on baulks or not, but there's an accompanying broad gauge era point indicator to go with it in what's captioned as a GW official view. It's on p. 46 of Ian Harrison's recent book on the Chard branches.

    Last edited: 12 June 2021
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  3. PhilH

    PhilH Western Thunderer

    Well the sky was a bit grey yesterday, but its blue today, haven't checked the sea but assume its still wet

    Graig Merthyr Colliery, Pontardulais - Line to colliery right, loco shed centre and landsale siding left. The A48 level crossing was just behind the loco shed. The use of flat bottom track was unusual for a NCB line.



    With the amount of material round the foot of the rail its difficult to see, but the rail was spiked directly to the sleepers without soleplates

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  4. PhilH

    PhilH Western Thunderer

    More on Graig Merthyr


    The colliery side of the A48 level crossing with the rear of the loco shed across the road. The front end of an out of use Austerity just visible under the awning to the right of the shed. On this side of the road a hand lever next to the gate and rodding connect to a catch point behind the camera. The rather rudimentary platform on the left was provided for the miners train, originally using a coach but later just 4 wheel vans with access steps and seating round the inside. These stopped running in the 1960s.


    A little further from the crossing is the catch point and rather decrepit signal.​


    The right hand rail seems to be supported on the outside by some cast iron fittings, fixed to the sleepers with two spikes.


    Further down the line towards the colliery on the outskirts of the town was a rather more substantial platform for the miners train, complete with a corrugated iron shelter. Note that a section of the line has been relaid in bullhead which extends round the curve in the distance and here it changes back to the original flat bottom. I managed to get the car in the photo, only a few months old then and we had 12 happy years together until the dreaded rust worm proved to be too much of a nuisance. This was on a two day "bash" of South Wales collieries and I spent the night in the car to get the early morning empties up to the colliery at Graig Merthyr. My employers at the time were quite willing to give 2 or three days off at short notice and the following week I spent 2 days on Scottish Collieries with another day on the way back in Cumbria. Happy Days !
  5. PhilH

    PhilH Western Thunderer

    More track details, this time with bullhead rail at Bickershaw Colliery



    Note in the background the heavily used fulls tracks - on which the Austerities were thrashed sometimes double headed up the gradient with loaded trains - have been relaid in flatbottom rail.


    The extra joint with only two bolts in the left hand stock rail is unusual. Note also the tie rod in the foreground holding the rails to gauge.



    General view of the sidings on a rather dull overcast day in 1974. A corner of the new coal preparation plant is just visible on the left; old screens centre left, by then not used for wagon loading, with their fulls weighbridge to the right; then the loco shed with HURRICANE at the water tank. The pithead with its headgear is in the left distance on the other side of a public road. Empties were propelled up the track in the foreground to the far side of the coal preparation plant and run through the plant by gravity for loading. By this time the top surface of any visible timber sleepers would be bleached weathered wood with little if any traces of creosote.
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  6. PhilH

    PhilH Western Thunderer


    Aberaman Colliery had been closed for 9 years when this view was taken in 1971. There's not much track visible under the grass, but the main reason for posting this view is the trackwork in the right foreground with two interlaced points. Maybe a good layout idea for saving space ?
    I believe the building in the background with the double curved roof was originally a wagon repair workshop although at the time of the photo it was completely empty except for one derelict steam locomotive - the last remaining Kerr Stuart 'Victory' class 0-6-0T.


    A scissors crossover at Tymawr Colliery with bullhead trackwork although not much visible below the rail heads. The building in the foreground with the wires hanging down each side of the wagon was a form of tippler where the wagon was tilted to discharge the load through the end door into a pit below.
  7. FH47331

    FH47331 Member

    What was the purpose of the tippler at Tymawr Colliery? Was this coal coming in for washing or blending?

  8. cbrailways

    cbrailways Western Thunderer

    The trackwork referred to in two posts above is another Barry Slip.
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  9. daifly

    daifly Western Thunderer

    It's not easy to see what is going on in the Barry slips in the photos above so here are lots of Barry slips - at Barry! (Edit - see below for corrected location). The Barry Railway were apparently very fond of them as a track formation in yards. Photo provenance unknown.
    Barry slips at Barry.jpg
    It is easiest to think of it as two opposing turnouts superimposed upon one another.
    Last edited: 14 June 2021
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  10. PhilH

    PhilH Western Thunderer

    Yes, most likely for dealing with "foreign" coal (i.e. coming from another NCB colliery rather than overseas), either for blending with a colliery's own coal to suit some customers requirements or washing coal from smaller pits with no washing facilities. Tymawr was merged with Lewis Merthyr in 1958, with coal wound at Tymawr and men and materials at Lewis Merthyr. Apparently the NCB invested £1.2M in underground and surface reorganisation for the merger, but there doesn't seem much sign of that in the photo.

    A book entitled "Practical Coal Mining for Miners" published in 1950 laid out the typical requirements for colliery sidings:

    "If site conditions permit of a suitable straight layout, the simple arrangements consist of an empty run-up for trains of empty wagons delivering to standage sidings, from which the wagons may be gravity fed over a tare weigh to the grading plant.
    It may be that "foreign" coal has to be prepared and arrangements are provided whereby wagons may be tipped and the coal elevated to the crusher house previously described and thence into the normal circuit.
    The loaded wagons from the grading plant are gravitated forward over a full weigh to accumulating sidings, where they are gathered in trains ready for disposal. Feeder sidings for materials by rail to yard storage, etc, are provided.
    Provided that mineral-full and empty transport can be gravity handled, as described, there is little wagon haulage required and material, goods, etc, can be conveniently hauled by means of a diesel locomotive which type is economically suitable for intermittent duties."

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  11. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    In an idle moment some time back, I went searching for Barry slips, and found this rather impressive array just outside Newport. I’m now going to have to try to find the discussion that sent me down that particular rabbit hole…

    Explore georeferenced maps - Map images - National Library of Scotland

    I did find it, on t’other channel. The conclusion was that Dave’s picture was at Newport, not Barry, but I can’t see or remember how or why.

    aha, I do now.

    Barry Slips at (not) Barry


    Last edited: 14 June 2021
  12. Jordan

    Jordan Mid-Western Thunderer

    Beat me to it (as have others!!)

    Jim Read has made Barry Slips in O Scale.
  13. daifly

    daifly Western Thunderer

    Might it have been here? This might have been where I nabbed the photo from. The same thread suggests that the location is actually Tredegar Park Sidings, one of the Alexandra Docks numerous yards which may be the yard in your linked map.
  14. simond

    simond Western Thunderer

    Indeed, Dave,

    it seems our posts crossed in the aether. The second link in my post refers to Martyn’s thread, and there’s an update which I guess is linked to his site.

  15. cbrailways

    cbrailways Western Thunderer

    Another interesting fact about the photographs of the Barry Slips (not at Barry) are that they are in flatbottom rail directly spiked to the sleepers.
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  16. Bazzmund

    Bazzmund Active Member

    There's a picture of a Midland connected colliery that looks like an extremely basic method of making moving point work. I think it was somewhere on what was the Leicester and Swannington, but I think the point blades were literally moved by hand without any levers involved. I doubt locos could be used though.