Sleepering on the Great Eastern

[Dog Star]

I want to read this article which was published in MRJ issue 33 of 1989 (page 246)... and my volume has gone AWOL at this time. If you have access to this article, please let me know if the table data includes rail length / sleepering details for the Great Eastern Railway circa 1875-1885.

thank you, Graham

 

[Steve Cook]

Hi Graham
I'm looking at it right now, I'm afraid there is no mention of the Great Eastern at all and what companies there are have data going back only as far as 1894.
Sorry.
Steve

 

[Dog Star]

... I'm afraid there is no mention of the Great Eastern at all and what companies there are have data going back only as far as 1894.

B****r, oh well, thank you for looking Steve. Maybe someone here might know the answer.

 

[Steve Cook]

B****r, oh well, thank you for looking Steve. Maybe someone here might know the answer.

No problem Graham
Isn't Mr Marks good at this sort of thing / digging out the info?
Steve

 

[Dog Star]

Isn't Mr Marks good at this sort of thing / digging out the info?

Um, yes, generally... as yet Adrian has not been able to provide an answer..

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Graham,
I have some info on file that came from Ade via a member of the GER Soc.
It concerns the period around 1883 and comes from the " Railway Engineer" which I assume to be a publication, it states that rail was 85 or 80lb Bullhead in length's of 30'-0". Max. cant was 1:16, chairs were spiked with keys of oak or larch.
Sleepers - 8'- 11" x 10" x 5" at avrerage ctr's of 3"- 0".
Ballast was broken stone or slag with ash on top.

Ade may come up with more.

Col.

 

[demu1037]

Graham,

GE Journal vol 17 pp 8 & 9 confirms Col's info above, except that only the middle 6 (of 11) sleepers are spaced at 3', at the ends of the panel, reduce to 2'8"/2'4" & 1'(i.e. 2' between panels)

Andy

 

[Dog Star]

Thank you all for your contributions to this thread.

To clarify the question... whilst 30' rails were common from the mid 1880s onwards Allen (Modern Permanent Way 1915) indicates that rail lengths were shorter in earlier days. For example, the LNWR used 27' rails at some time before Crewe commenced rolling 30' rails. Allen gives 24' as a typical rail length for plain line before (say) 1880 and the original post was aimed at GER PW with 24' rails.

thank you all, regards, Graham

 

[Overseer]

This is not quite the answer to the question but may be of interest. The 1855 edition of The Practical Railway Engineer by G. Drysdale Dempsey has some information on track that would probably still have been in use in sidings etc in the 1870s. It is not directly labelled as Great Eastern (obviously as it predates the formation of the GER) or Eastern Counties Railway but the text explains the invention of fishplates by W.B Adams and R. Richardson and the mileage in use on the Eastern Counties Railway. The illustration of the fish plated track doesn't give the rail length used and I can't see it mentioned in the text.

The sleeper at the bottom of the image is distorted in the scan as it is across the fold.

Some dimensions are given in the following table, also from Dempsey.

Interesting that the sleepers on the ECR were 8'6" long at this time, and 10 x 4 1/2" at 3' centres. Rails were 75lb double headed.

Now who is going to produce 7mm scale double headed rail in the smaller sizes suitable for models of the earlier periods? Code 124 bullhead rail is too big and just doesn't look right for earlier models. I should check what is currently available for S scale as it could be useable.

 

[JimG]

Now who is going to produce 7mm scale double headed rail in the smaller sizes suitable for models of the earlier periods? Code 124 bullhead rail is too big and just doesn't look right for earlier models. I should check what is currently available for S scale as it could be useable.

The current bullhead rail available for S scale in the UK is Code 87. The SSMRS had this rail specially drawn to represent 95lb rail. It replaced the Code 95 rail which had been the UK S scale standard for years and which had been available from several commercial sources in the past. But those sources dried up and we had to get our own supply produced. The Code 87 rail equates to rail of around 3.75 inches high in 7mm scale. The now discontinued Code 95 rail would have equated to about 4.125" in 7mm scale.

Jim.

 

[phileakins]

Graham

A reliable source of trackwork data are accident reports, particularly those involving derailment when the inspector will invariably include details of the permanent way (and sometimes sketches) in the report.

A good selection can be found here. There is a very good search facility and you can sign up for a newsletter so that you don't miss out on future additions to the collection.

Phil

 

[Dog Star]

Thanks Phil,

The Railways Archive is a good resource for the obscure - I have read all of the reports relevant to the Metropolitan Railway and the Widened Lines (for Basilica Fields). This past week I have been plodding through those for the Eastern Counties and Great Eastern for the period 1855-90... which has produced several reports that substantiate the drawing from Fraser, generally for accidents in the late 1860s and for track laid circa 1867/8. Unfortunately not a single reference to rail lengths on the GER during the period of interest - that may be down to the small number of reports which have surfaced 1870s and 1880s.

regards, Graham

 

[Dog Star]

Phil mentions the accident reports which are being put on line at the Railways Archive - working my way forward from circa 1850 there are several recurring "incidents" which might be considered as "themes":-

1/ how little consideration had been given to the running of the system as an unified whole - even within areas as small as a town station... railway time had only just been established as a necessary measure and the absence of interlocking leading to contradictory movements within station limits;
2/ being able to fast forward for selected incidents (using the search filters) illustrates how the generic railway was developing in terms of process and technology... for example:- iron rails in 15' lengths or shorter circa 1855 has become steel rails in 21'... 24'... and even 30' lengths by 1880 as the steel industry developed to meet the demands of the railways (reacting to the demands of heavier stock as a result of greater traffic demands);
3/ long and un-social hours for those at the "coal face" with the ever-present risk of injury.

Returning to the subject of this thread, here is a photo which depicts track that has a "sparse" nature to the sleepering as depicted in the post from Fraser earlier in the topic.



I am not able to credit this image... if anyone can oblige then I shall be pleased to add an acknowledgement.