7mm US model dabblings

[richard carr]

You may have seen this for sale last week, it was just too tempting to say no to.



It really is a nice model, so now I have to decide what livery it is going to carry.






I am leaning towards Southern Pacific in Grey and Red, so does any one know where I can get the correct colours from and where I can get some decals from ?

The model also came with these, again does anyone know what these are all for ?

 

[JasonD]

Nice find Richard. I tried rrpicturearchives.net and for this S12:
Railroad Picture Archives.NET
The editor here(?) annoyingly replaces the full link with the 'heading' version in Blue, but it shows up when you select it. IT'S ANNOYING!!

The pics have some variety using some of those parts: alternative radiator with the extra divisions. Hood-top bell with legs and frame-mounted bell(?), alternative exhaust stack, 2 marker lights with their mounting brackets, cab-door handles(?!), cab side-window shades (they're big, is Californian sun that hot).

SP paint ... er, I'm a D&H modeller, good luck.
Jason

 

[mickoo]

Those sun shades are BIG , there's an oval stack as compared to the flower pot one fitted, those globes look like steam engine marker lights, maybe applicable to some earlier period diesels like the S12, frame bell and bonnet bell with the A frame legs, no idea what the bolted flange bits are for. Grill I suspect is a winterization cover and they would tarp over sections depending on how cold it was.

Dave will be the SP colour expert, I've got some Vallejo greys and reds that should suffice but they have to be mixed to get the right hues and I can't remember the mix or the colours used (all mixed up in one box now), worse yet, I can't recall where I've written it down.

A fair few BLH2 had massive light units on the SP but some seem to remain as stock.

SP 2101 in Eugene by Steve Sloan, on Flickr

SP 2110 in Eugene by Steve Sloan, on Flickr

From the above it shows the sun shade as canvas, which might account for it's size but the shape you have would be more normal for a steel type.

Here's a couple with steel shades and enlarged light units.

SP Baldwin 2128 in 1972 by Steve Sloan, on Flickr

SP 2150 in LA by Steve Sloan, on Flickr

One thing that is apparent though, the grey and red is pretty much anything you want, just weather the hell out of it

 

[Jordan]

Those sun shades are BIG

Aren't they just?!!
Personally I would've suggested a very, very very light gray & red color scheme, & could help with decals but the Soo Line didn't have any Baldwin S12s, in fact they only ever had a handful of Baldwins anyway.

 

[mickoo]

Decals should be Microscale 48-7, I've got three set from a few years back as I know Microscale can be a bit hit and miss to get.

Mine are marked diesels 1970's - 1991 yet on their site right now they're marked as 1984 - 1991?

Microscale Decals: O Scale - Southern Pacific Hood Diesels (1984-1991) - 2 Sheet Set

Microsacle do a pretty good postage direct to the UK and you shouldn't get taxed as I think decals are considered printed matter and thus exempt, I haven't yet but that may have just been luck.

Champ or K4 might do some but a quick check didn't reveal any, neither do Switchline or CircusCity, the latter are very good. A quick service and will re-scale other scales into 1:48 if it's not available, but the minimum order is two and at the higher scale price, usually G scale. You pay a few $ more (typically 2-3) but for a bespoke scaling I consider that a bargain.

There's a guy on Ebay with six sets of 48-7 and P&D models often stock decals long since stopped by Microscale but appear not to have 48-7 on stock but they do have a set 48-046 Southern Pacific Diesel Switchers, but typical of P&D....no images, I've done a web search and can't find a image of whats on there and they're not in the Microscale catalogue anymore. Sometimes Microscale keep the same suffix and you can cross reference with other scales, so 48-046 is 87-046 (HO) or 60-046 (N).

 

[Scale7JB]

You may have seen this for sale last week, it was just too tempting to say no to.

View attachment 153281

It really is a nice model, so now I have to decide what livery it is going to carry.

View attachment 153282


View attachment 153283

I am leaning towards Southern Pacific in Grey and Red, so does any one know where I can get the correct colours from and where I can get some decals from ?

The model also came with these, again does anyone know what these are all for ?

View attachment 153284

Where did you find that?!

JB.

 

[richard carr]

On here of course !

Richard

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

I am leaning towards Southern Pacific in Grey and Red, so does any one know where I can get the correct colours from and where I can get some decals from ?

Dave will be the SP colour expert, I've got some Vallejo greys and reds that should suffice but they have to be mixed to get the right hues and I can't remember the mix or the colours used (all mixed up in one box now), worse yet, I can't recall where I've written it down.

Firstly you'll have difficulty obtaining Floquil/Polly Scale paints as Testors discontinued these line of paints in 2013.

Joe Fugate produced The Model Railroad Hobbyist’s Guide to acrylic painting ... in a post-Floquil world Published by MRH Media (Model Railroad Hobbyist) and have attached a PDF copy to this post. It's a useful guide and contains information the paint mix ratios required for various Railroads and tips on using acrylic paints.

Vallejo acrylic paints are the easiest to obtain here in the UK. The equivalent Vallejo Model Air (VMA) colours required are:

VMA 71.003 (Scarlet Red) for SP Scarlet
VMA 71.121 (USAF Light Grey) for SP Lettering Grey
VMA 71.128 (Grey Violet) for SP Lark Light Grey
VMA 71.048 (Dark Sea Grey) for SP Lark Dark Grey

Vallejo Model Air colours are formulated for airbrush use without thinners.

Just to show the Vallejo colours this is model of my finished SSW GP9 using Dark Sea Grey and Scarlet Red. Decals are from Microscale.


This shows the comparison of the completed and weathered SSW model against one under conversion to a SP ex T&NO GP9 (right). This is the Vallejo scarlet red airbrushed straight from the bottle.


And the Dark Sea Grey - when wet the grey appears dark but dries lighter.


Hope it helps.

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

The model also came with these, again does anyone know what these are all for ?

Hi Richard,

The parts had already been identified by @mickoo and @JasonD - here are the parts with their names for ease. The grey wires look like grab irons



Enjoy modelling the SP.

 

[Jordan]

Where did you find that?!

JB.

On here of course !

Richard

The Ad has been removed now The loco has P48 wheelsets if I recall correctly.

 

[richard carr]

Gentlemen

Thank you for all the information on the parts, paint and decals.

This is for a well into the future modelling project once I have retired, hopefully not too far away.

Yes Jordan it has p48 wheels, but I do believe you can buy P48 flex track ?


Richard

 

[Yorkshire Dave]

Yes Jordan it has p48 wheels, but I do believe you can buy P48 flex track ?

Yes you can Right-O-Way Online Catalog - Flex Track-all guages

 

[JasonD]

RoW under newish owner Jay Criswell is actively bringing P48 (and Ow5) stuff to the market ... good O-scaler. As I've mentioned before, I have branded P48 33" and 36" wheels from an Estate sale, but I've been following Ow5 for too long to be excited. I do have odd packs of code 100, 125 and 148 flat-bottom rail and other track bits and some P48 track-laying triangle gauges and maybe a steel gauge (like the NMRA stds gauge) or two. Yes, there's more: shorter truck bolsters to convert 'Athearn' trucks to P48 (with different wheels of course). Happy to do swaps on parts, gave up being an importer/trader ... er, um ... when I was younger.
Jason

 

[Overseer]

Yes you can Right-O-Way Online Catalog - Flex Track-all guages

How did you get that link? When I look at the Right-O-Way website it doesn't link to that page anymore. I have been meaning to ask Jay if he has, or is getting, new stock of the P48 flex track as I think I need some.

As an S7 modeller the standard US O gauge wheels are hard to take. They are much coarser than Slaters 'Finescale' wheels. P48 looks much better and if you don't have 32mm gauge track to run US models on you might as well do it right and build P48 track. These are the PD Hobbies trucks, one with the Right-O-Way P48 conversion fitted.

 

[JasonD]

Fairly soon after Weaver brought out their gearboxes the O-scale community decided that code 176 wheels, on the right-hand wheelset above, were out-of-date. The alternative at the time (made the front of RMC mag) was the 1/4"AAR finescale experiment, which developed into P48 with correct track gauge and code 115 wheel profile (left-hand wheelset). The code refers to the wheel width in inches.

O-scalers trying the 115 wheels on existing track found the tyre width and flange depth unforgiving and some RTR manufacturers tried a compromise, code 145. This is the common choice, picked belatedly by the NMRA for their O-scale RP-25 dimensions. I don't know of any Nth Am manufacturer using anything near code 176, except 3-railers being lazy or desperate (Atlas 0-6-0).

Yes, P&D for example still sell Weaver code 176 wheels, but these are not new. They are what was picked up by Des Plaines and P&D when China drives were adopted. NWSL sell code 145 replacement wheelsets. Bad pic of 145 and 176 follows:

 

[JasonD]

BTW I'm spreading O-scale Nth American stuff over a couple of tables at the NMRABR Winter Meet on Sunday, yes Sunday Jan 30th. Just been told by Mick Moignard that it's not at Benson, but down the M40 at Stokenchurch, details coming. In my early 20s I used to stop on the forecourt of a pub there that's just burned down to listen on the radio to the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy ... before the M40 made it to Oxford ... and you could get a pint and pie for 1/6d. Oh, and Spirit just started ... playing Fresh Garbage on the player ... saw them at Crouch End Town Hall in the mid-60s with my school mates.... Aaah! Go do something useful Jason!!
Jason

 

[Jordan]

P48 looks much better and if you don't have 32mm gauge track to run US models on you might as well do it right and build P48 track. These are the PD Hobbies trucks, one with the Right-O-Way P48 conversion fitted.

Yes P48 can look much, much better - wouldn't be worthwhile if it didn't!! But have the truck frames been moved inwards on that P&D truck?
If not, why not? They are still inaccurate 'as is', not to mention the gap between brake blocks and wheel treads!!
And that, apart from the unforgiving nature of proto scale wheels et al, is why I didn't go for P48 myself, despite starting from scratch hand laying my track. There is rather more to going P48 than just laying track to the correct gauge and changing wheelsets - all trucks, locos and cars, need the sideframes moving in towards the wheels, and they are going to need decent springing or compensation ideally, which the P&D/Weaver type trucks do have.
It's all cost and effort that I myself don't have the time for, nor would it increase my enjoyment of the hobby in proportion to that time and effort.

 

[Jordan]

Just grabbed a quick photo to compare the wheels on a Red Caboose/Atlas GP9, and a Heljan Class 31.
I don't see any reason to get too sniffy about US O Scale wheels.

 

[mickoo]

Jordan, I think the Roco/Atlas F9 trucks are much closer to scale than corresponding US RTR.

Not sure if the trucks are exact scale width, but out of the box they appear significantly better than an Atlas 2R GP60 and I'm sure the Roco/Atlas wheels are thinner than RTR 2R offerings.

There is certainly mileage in reducing truck width on 2R RTR from MTH/Atlas and thinner scale wheels where possible, but only if it's an easy drop in solution, or easy tweak from other wheels.

I'll grab my GP9 and the Atlas GP60 and do a comparison shot like yours, for no other reason than I can

Like you, both S7 and P48 do not give me enough return for the energy expended, I admire and respect those that do it but that anorak is not in any of my closets.

 

[Jordan]

Ok, the GP9 vs a 'modern Atlas' SD40. Yes the wheels on the SD40 are a bit wider, not much in it though?

The worst thing with modern Atlas locos is the 3-rail legacy of the sideframes - they're waaay out, even for OW5...

But even though they need shifting in even for ordinary 2 rail, from normal viewpoints, personally I don't lose sleep over it...


Now an Atlas Trinity hopper vs a UK wagon (Parkside I think).
Again not much in it, for me, although the Atlas axle is far too skinny to be prototypical.

But from normal viewpoint....

.... good enough for me. Just depends on how high your sights are set, I suppose.