7mm 7mm Mick's Workbench - JLTRT Royal Scot

[7mmMick]

Thanks Col, I'll see what the LG ones come out like but in any case thanks for the offer.

Email sent; lots of history and info plus a GA and photos. You should be able to ascertain which the D&S model is by comparing against the dimensions of the three diagrams in the text and the GA of the D.25. OTTOMH I'm sure it's the D.50 as the D.25s had longitudinal planking and the D.75s were a little bigger and heavier.

Email received Adrian, cracking article, just what I needed, thankyou. Looking at the notes it looks like a transformer of some kind will be right at home lashed to the deck. I'm sure I have one somewhere which is made of white metal so that will way it down nicely.

ATB Mick

 

[7mmMick]

Well this is indeed a long overdue update but in my defence the last few months have been extremely busy and as usual the hobby comes last so i've had little time at the bench. On my Christmas list however was a Laurie Griffin GE Brake van as I had seen a picture of the six wheel type at Hull springhead around 1953 which was ideal for the period and location I model. After consulting both Buckjumper and Eeastsidepilot of this parish I and taking their advice for a suitable kit I ordered one from LG at Telford, only to have the wife snatch it away on arrival for a Christmas present

So since Christmas I have been able to make a start. The kit is very nice indeed but somewhat dated as the original I think was marketed by Jedenco. The good news is it is now part of the Shedmaster range and there are as you can imagine some lovely updated castings from LG. Unfortunately these don't always go together well and need some fettling.

The van i'm going to build is 601589 and unfortunately I can't put a picture on here but here are the links to a couple of the four wheel version ( mine is a six wheel )

http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lnerbrake/e379ff7d3
http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lnerbrake/e22d5eb41

Before I started I sought Adrian's advice and he came up trumps and forwarded drawings and lots of helpful notes about the kit and prototype, this proved invaluable and set me down the right path to make a start. so here's progress to date;


The body comes as a flat etch to fold up which is strainght forward. 601589 however had no veranda doors in the 50's and as you can see they are etched in so had to be removed

So here's the progress so far, which doesn't seem much but the cody is folded up and the partition doors have handles made up from the spares box and the brake hand wheels fitted. Also done is the sole bars, which to be honest are a pain as you have to fold into a U section. The folded sole bar in quite shallow and my bending bars were just too thick for it, needless to say the air was blue for a short time until this was done. With that in mind can anyone recommend a method for folding such shallow sections please?


A close up of one partition, the instructions state here to fit inset but nothing further. Adrian's drawing came up trumps here as it has the dimensions of 10'6'' for the partitions over centres so this was marked out so they could be fitted in place. Not too difficult but it would have been much easier to mark this prior to folding up the body, all part of the learning curve I suppose


The final picture highlights the issues with removing the veranda doors in as much as with them fitted this area would be difficult to see so detail has been ommitted. Now with them removed you can see the floor will have to be represented and the plank detail on the rear of the ends also. Can anyone recommend matrials/methods for this please? I was thinking plastikard as the last job? Looking forward to cracking on with this, I have a few parts on order to acheive the detail I want and i'll post these when they arrive,

ATB Mick

 

[SteveO]

Really nice Mick. What were those etches in the veranda ends?

 

[7mmMick]

Hi Steve,

Not sure which bit you mean but the etched doors were just part of the main body sheet and had to be cut away with a piercing saw, there is also an half etched overlay fixed to the outside end to represent the ironwork. The cast hand wheels on the partition ends are LG and the door handles are a Slaters casting chopped up. Apologies if this doesn't answer though,

ATB Mick

 

[SteveO]

Ah, I can make it out now, it looks like some strapping or washerplates - I'm referring to the pic of the etch in the flat where there are some bits inside the veranda open ends. You had it on your second guess!

Cheers Mick

 

[Buckjumper]

Ah the solebars - they encountered my wrath too! Several passes with the Olfa cutter until you see a decent witness line on the reverse, then run a square file along at 45 degrees so that enough brass is removed to ensure the fold is square. That should be sufficient for a Hold & Fold to deal with, though there's not a lot of metal for it to grab. I'm sure I ended up tapping it all home gently over a suitable former with a small hammer. Careful though as you'll probably have the urge to hit it really hard...

I have an inkling that the solebars are a too shallow in section anyway - wait until you've got to fit the cast brackets. - that'll turn the air blue. You might want to consider trading some solebar depth with Steve as he's got too much on his Lochgorm vans.

Plastikard planking on the rear of the verandah ends and on the floor should work perfectly. You could even do the underside of the roof when you get that far.

 

[Dog Star]

Plastikard planking on the rear of the verandah ends and on the floor should work perfectly. You could even do the underside of the roof when you get that far.

And the inside of the body sheeting for the cabin? Not forgetting the sheet steel plate to prevent scorching of the woodwork by the stove.

regards, Graham

 

[SteveO]

For what it's worth, I had a similar tricky folding job with my stanchions (link here). I managed it by doing plenty of scoring, as Adrian has described above. Actually, the more I did, the deeper the scoring and the easier it got.

My method was to score the folds as deep as I dare then clamp (vise or mini G clamps) them between a piece of wood at the back and a steel rule inside the fold and bend over slowly with another rule. It worked very well. There was a slight springyness to the brass so not all folds were 90deg. I simply touched them up using the bench to press them to shape.

 

[7mmMick]

Thanks for the advice chaps. For the sole bars and folding up the main body I did score the folds which really did help but what I didn't do is probably score them enough and I didn't turn them over and use a file to have a go at the other side. I ended up doing really what you both suggested a bit and doing as much as I could with the bending bars and then teasing the rest around, slowly and very carefully

I have an inkling that the solebars are a too shallow in section anyway - wait until you've got to fit the cast brackets. - that'll turn the air blue. You might want to consider trading some solebar depth with Steve as he's got too much on his Lochgorm vans.

I think you're right Adrian..... and about them being too small. On reading your notes I thought I'll have a look see I can fatham what he means there. When I offered up the castings I thought, Oh bugger that's gonna be a right pain in the backside, not looking forward to it at all More to follow on that when I get there.


And the inside of the body sheeting for the cabin? Not forgetting the sheet steel plate to prevent scorching of the woodwork by the stove.
I like the idea of this Graham but i'm not sure if this is a bridge too far as when the roof is on as almost nothing will be seen. While I mull this over does anyone have an interior picture of one of these vans just in case?

ATB Mick

 

[Buckjumper]

No photo, but I have a drawing I can sort out for you.

 

[7mmMick]

No photo, but I have a drawing I can sort out for you.

Great stuff Adrian, that would be ideal

ATB Mick

 

[Eastsidepilot]

Now with them removed you can see the floor will have to be represented and the plank detail on the rear of the ends also. Can anyone recommend matrials/methods for this please? I was thinking plastikard as the last job? Looking forward to cracking on with this, I have a few parts on order to acheive the detail I want and i'll post these when they arrive,

ATB Mick

Nice job Mick, how about thin ply strip I have used this for cab floor boards also.

Col.

 

[7mmMick]

Nice job Mick, how about thin ply strip I have used this for cab floor boards also.

Col.

Cheers Col, I also like the idea of the plywood strips, can you recommend a supplier?

ATB Mick

 

[7mmMick]

A very small update on the GE Brake, although what you can't tell here is that there's a lot of hours put in since the last post. First job was to run the roof through the rolling bars to sort out the profile,
I then cleaned up all the T stanchions for the side detailing which come in two parts ( four each side, two each end ) and as you can imagine after a good rub up with some wet and dry they look very nice indeed. Now this is where I realised what Adrian means above, as you can see the fit is a 'little' off the bottom part is supossed to sit inside the solebar?



So I set about trying to make it fit and ended up loosing half the bottom bracket

Then I fitted and shaped them to suit


I'm by no means happy with this to be honest, plus this one needs more filling. Below is where I'm at now, I've also fitted stanchions to one end. Again they're very nice but this means filing off all the detail on the overlay underneath, probably easier doing this prior to assembly. Yet more lessons learned I've also fitted some beading around the top of the body as this van had this fitted later by the LNER I presume.

As you can see from this final shot the side stanchions don't reach all the way to the top of the body sides so i'll have to add some material in here, not sure that'll i'll be able to make it seemless ?

Can anyone offer a better way of sorting out tackle the missing stanchion sections and sorting out the oversize parts, if not I have lots of hours of fitting to do on the rest

ATB Mick

P.S lots of cleaning up still to do so don't judge to early

 

[Dikitriki]

Hi Mick

looks pretty clean to me already. Those bottom brackets are a bit off being so oversize.

I think I'd scratchbuild new side stanchions from T section lengths, probably quicker in the long run than trying to fill and blend in joins.

Richard

 

[Dog Star]

I think I'd scratchbuild new side stanchions from T section lengths, probably quicker in the long run than trying to fill and blend in joins.

I agree. A photo showing how the stanchion turned under the body and affixed to the solebar might help us all to understand the magnitude - or ease - of making new and accurate parts.

regards, Graham

 

[micknich2003]

Mick, will look good trundling past Holderness Drain North. Mick

 

[7mmMick]

Hi Mick

looks pretty clean to me already. Those bottom brackets are a bit off being so oversize.

I think I'd scratchbuild new side stanchions from T section lengths, probably quicker in the long run than trying to fill and blend in joins.

Richard

I agree. A photo showing how the stanchion turned under the body and affixed to the solebar might help us all to understand the magnitude - or ease - of making new and accurate parts.

regards, Graham

Thanks for the feedback chaps. To be honest i'm about fifty fifty at the moment. There are a couple of factors that haven't taken me down that route yet, one is that I've already bought in lots of extras for this kit and promised myself to try and make do with whats remaining and second, Adrian ( Buckjumper ) has made an extremely lovely job of his and I think he used the castings in the kit. Unfortunatley I can't post the picture i'm using as it's from Tatlow's Pictorial record. The picture does show an eye level view of the solebar and stanchion which is extremely usefull and from what I can see what i've managed is a reasonable representation. Maybe Adrian could post a picture of his if he doesn't mind and you'll be able to see what I'm trying to acheive, just with an extra axle in the middle More thought needed on this......

ATB Mick

 

[Buckjumper]

I bought my van when Dick Bollen owned the Shedmaster range and it didn't come with some of these casting but you had to fiddle them up from some iffy etched parts. When I came to build it Laurie had taken over the range on and produced these castings - but by the time I found out I was much advanced on the basic shell with the solebars folded up and in place. Laurie sent the bracket castings which are AFAICT are correct to prototype, and they obviously showed up the incorrect depth and height of the solebars. I decided to plough on, altering the castings. I did fill and blend the side stanchions rather than make some up from T-section, and that worked out OK.

TNH the whole kit is a bit of a to-do (well it is an enlarged Jidenco kit, so what do you expect!) and as mine was to commission it was a case of making the best job to the agreed budget. I did warn Mick that there would be some times during the build when he'd run the gamut of emotions, but at the end of the build he'd feel like

The one thing I wished I had done was beef up the long footboards.

 

[7mmMick]

TNH the whole kit is a bit of a to-do (well it is an enlarged Jidenco kit, so what do you expect!) and as mine was to commission it was a case of making the best job to the agreed budget. I did warn Mick that there would be some times during the build when he'd run the gamut of emotions, but at the end of the build he'd feel like

I was suitably warned, I can't deny it Problems aside it's still a good kit and i'm having a great time building it, it's all about the journey and all that The brake blocks on your van look very nice indeed Adrian, are they scratch built as the only ones that come with the kit are etched on with the W-irons?

ATB Mick

P.S thanks for posting the pictures, very inspirational