Mickoo's American Modelling Empire

Mick, re the 200 mile trip without seeing anything that wasn't flat, I have had the good fortune to travel across Canada on the Canadian. You spend a whole day travelling across the prairies. The only visible things are planted by man or built by man!

Similarly the trip from Chicago to Denver on the Zephyr, I did it just to experience this vast area of flat land.

Tim

mickoo said:

The other layout was O gauge and a compact double oval, tight curves and short straights but it had trains moving and seemed popular.

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The O scale layout was conceived of as a way to promote the scale, to combat the idea that you had to have a lot of space to do something because it was so large. Or that the only way to do something reasonable was to go the 3-rail route with its tight curves. I'm sure Jordan would have something to say about that. The premise was that it would mimic the idea of an HO layout built on the the bog standard (in the US) 4'x8' sheet of plywood, which is a very common starter layout over here. This O scale layout is 8'x16', done to p48 standards.

It was part of a concerted effort by the O Scale Central group to promote O scale to the great unwashed, which included the layout and a "learning station", plus a row of tables loaded with some nice O scale/p48 models. I knew the O Scale Central group would be there, but there were quite a few more O scale modelers in attendance than I expected. Overall there was a fair amount of O scale or p48 models on the tables, more than I have seen at any RPM or other all-scales show, which I found very encouraging.

mickoo said:

One other vendor caught my eye, road/street signs, very 'American', I'm not sure if these are 3D printed but I wouldn't be surprised, again another photo as a memory jogger for later.

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I walked around the show I don't know how many times, and I never noticed these signs! Makes me wonder what else I missed. To be fair there were a lot more people to talk to than I expected, and I ended up spending most of my time discussing various topics. That's fine, as I definitely think it's a valuable aspect of shows. But I guess I should have taken more time see what all was on the tables.

The same could be said for the diorama with the pipe dozers. I walked past that several times without really looking at it closely. I'd be very interested in a couple of side boom dozers like that as they are the preferred tool these days for cleaning up derailments or performing field maintenance like wheelset replacements.

mickoo said:

The Walters Mainline tanks are from the simpler end of the range, probably plastic wheels (though they do look metal) and moulded grabs, but being as tank car have no moulded grabs they all have to be separate, compared to the next level up I couldn't see a lot of difference....except price, you get three mainline for two in the next detail level.

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I'm pretty sure the Mainline cars will have metal wheelsets, even as the lower price point line from Walthers. It's clear that plastic wheelsets are problematic, and the switch to metal wheels has been pretty much widespread across the hobby.

As discussed previously, I think you should accept the molded on grabs for things like the hoppers and tank cars, most cars actually, for the "playing trains" aspect of your modeling. Especially if it lets you get the variety and quantity of rolling stock you need at a reasonable cost. To that end, the Mainline cars are actually good options, and I'd say the same for the Mainline locomotives. They don't have as much detail as ome other models, but the drives are the same as on the Walthers Proto (highest price point) models, and it's widely considered one of the best in HO right now.

I'm as compulsive as can be, but even I have to concede that things like separate grabs become a lot less important once the trains start moving. Shooting static scenes is different, I think it's proper to focus on the details for models intended for that purpose. I think Dave suggested the same above.

Jim

Big Train James said:

The O scale layout was conceived of as a way to promote the scale, to combat the idea that you had to have a lot of space to do something because it was so large. Or that the only way to do something reasonable was to go the 3-rail route with its tight curves. I'm sure Jordan would have something to say about that. The premise was that it would mimic the idea of an HO layout built on the the bog standard (in the US) 4'x8' sheet of plywood, which is a very common starter layout over here. This O scale layout is 8'x16', done to p48 standards.

It was part of a concerted effort by the O Scale Central group to promote O scale to the great unwashed, which included the layout and a "learning station", plus a row of tables loaded with some nice O scale/p48 models. I knew the O Scale Central group would be there, but there were quite a few more O scale modelers in attendance than I expected. Overall there was a fair amount of O scale or p48 models on the tables, more than I have seen at any RPM or other all-scales show, which I found very encouraging.


I walked around the show I don't know how many times, and I never noticed these signs! Makes me wonder what else I missed. To be fair there were a lot more people to talk to than I expected, and I ended up spending most of my time discussing various topics. That's fine, as I definitely think it's a valuable aspect of shows. But I guess I should have taken more time see what all was on the tables.

The same could be said for the diorama with the pipe dozers. I walked past that several times without really looking at it closely. I'd be very interested in a couple of side boom dozers like that as they are the preferred tool these days for cleaning up derailments or performing field maintenance like wheelset replacements.


I'm pretty sure the Mainline cars will have metal wheelsets, even as the lower price point line from Walthers. It's clear that plastic wheelsets are problematic, and the switch to metal wheels has been pretty much widespread across the hobby.

As discussed previously, I think you should accept the molded on grabs for things like the hoppers and tank cars, most cars actually, for the "playing trains" aspect of your modeling. Especially if it lets you get the variety and quantity of rolling stock you need at a reasonable cost. To that end, the Mainline cars are actually good options, and I'd say the same for the Mainline locomotives. They don't have as much detail as ome other models, but the drives are the same as on the Walthers Proto (highest price point) models, and it's widely considered one of the best in HO right now.

I'm as compulsive as can be, but even I have to concede that things like separate grabs become a lot less important once the trains start moving. Shooting static scenes is different, I think it's proper to focus on the details for models intended for that purpose. I think Dave suggested the same above.

Jim

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Having down scaled from O I didn't (shamefully) take much notice, I never realized it was P48 either, just that the SD40-2 sounded good.

There was quite a bit of yellow machinery around the show, one stand had masses of it in several scales, I was taken by the D9 or even the D11, think Meng do the military version in 1:35, very tempting as a side palette cleanser.

The side booms looked good and I though the same, but these looked a bit smaller than the ones used by Railroads for debris clearance, I maybe wrong as it's one of those 'to research' projects in due course (probably never).

The stock fidelity aspect is a funny thing, in O it seems to be the be and end all, anything less is looked down on 'have to have the best detail you can old chap' I get that to a certain extent in O but moving down to HO it's taking a while to wash that ethos out of me.....it's very hard work

More so as I practice the 'I know it's there' aspect with commissions and internal details between the frames that can only be seen when it crashes and rolls over. The irony and conflict of the two aspects in scale, hobby and commercial work is not lost on me.

The price structure helps, especially if you're looking for 20-25 car trains, six or seven times over.

Big Train James said:

The O scale layout was conceived of as a way to promote the scale, to combat the idea that you had to have a lot of space to do something because it was so large. Or that the only way to do something reasonable was to go the 3-rail route with its tight curves. I'm sure Jordan would have something to say about that. The premise was that it would mimic the idea of an HO layout built on the the bog standard (in the US) 4'x8' sheet of plywood, which is a very common starter layout over here. This O scale layout is 8'x16', done to p48 standards.

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Ooh, would like to see pictures of that!! It's only a foot shorter than my space, so what did they do in that space?
Tight curves to P:48 sounds impressive; was the track hand laid, could you tell? I bet it was smooth, level & even!!
One of the comments I got (on RMweb IIRC) regarding my hand laid track was "why bother laying it to the wrong gauge?". Well yes that could be an argument for P:48, & if I had, I could have used Right-O-Way's cast self-guarding frogs, but of course there's rather more to P:48 than the track gauge - as well as the cost and time factor of replacement wheelsets (since I don't have a lathe or the skill to use one); there's also the matter of narrowing truck sideframes on locos & rolling stock, and for me the important matter of 'rough' track, and using a standard that can cope with it, with minimal effort on my part....

I'm sure there are photos somewhere, but I'm not sure where at the moment. Instead, I point you to the O Scale Central Youtube channel, where they have two videos, 2 Rail O Scale 2016 and 2 Rail O Scale 2017. The layout is the first one featured in the 2016 video. That should get you started.

Jim

Oh and the obsession with the 50s-60s 'Transition' Era does my head in!!
Ok I'm not into really up-to-date locos, Generation 3 or 4, or whatever they're up to now, but would like some modern-ish rolling stock in O Scale, like 64ft Trinity Reefers, & more variety in boxcar types - waffle-sides, double doors, etc.

Should probably add these to your "remember for the future" list.....

Big Train James said:

Should probably add these to your "remember for the future" list.....

View attachment 220636

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Where they at the show! I need quite a few of them, I thought I was going to have to scratch build them but these will save time.

They were available at the show. I guess I'm not the only one that missed some stuff.

They're made by Custom Finishing. I tried to look some prototypes up online to see if the models compared well, but had trouble finding photos. Nearly all of what I found dealt with the antennae found on locomotive cab roofs rather than the lineside variety. I'm sure a deeper dive would come up with something better.

They actually seem quite simple really. I suspect you could scratch build them without too much effort.

Jim

They look pretty good from the photos I took and have found on line (typically Google earth driving by). This installation is exactly the one I want on the water level section before the bridge, the double aspect will protect the switch at the far end, might be a bit far away but this one seems quite far from it's switch, I'd have to check google maps to see exactly how far away it is.

More to the point do they have advanced double heads, one close to the switch and the next furthest to give advanced warning of a divert?





I also want one of those cabins with the lights affixed to the top, several actually.....



I'd thought I'd taken more photos of these....but clearly didn't (face-palm).

The other installation has stand alone cabinets and lights, the masts are quite tall, probably too tall for the height of my levels so some selective shortening will need to be employed.





In the last shot there are double aspects and again I've no idea where the sidings are or how close, again could be advanced aspects for divergence.

I wonder if they add extra advanced signalling given that the route twists and turns a fair amount so visibility is limited to an insufficient distance.

BLMA used to offer individual hooded signal heads to go along with their assortment of bridge and mast mounted signals. The whole lot went to Atlas several years back, and it looks like they still offer the indvidual signal heads. They are currently out of stock, but they are listed. You could also potentially adapt some of the mast type signals to a 3d printed cabinet to create the types you show above.

I did wonder that but on further thought, you are going to have to have at least one further one to the one protecting the switch, because if this is red then you'll need an amber to protect that. Technically you should have one behind that to show a green, but I don't think any sidings that can be ripped through on a green, therefore the entry will always be an amber and the switch one could be a limited approach red and only releases once speed/time has hit the required trigger.

I don't have the track chart for the Gorge, just the timetable, they are available....for a fee, you used to be able to get them from the Railroads with some convoluted Google searching but they all seem to have been moved either off line or behind even more protection, understandable of course.

The relay hut I need to work out basic measurements, some are larger than others it seems. The individual heads would be good for the bespoke hut units but normal twin heads on a single post would be good as a RTR for the majority of the line, though I do plan to have two or three sidings for interest/holding opposing trains etc. I have only one (current planning) location for a big cantilever twin track gantry mind

I decided this weekend I'd be selfish and just focus on the hobby side for a change.

The base boards are progressing around the building, not everyone's taste but typical US 'shelf' layout, focused more on running with generic scenery than faithfully reproduction of somewhere specific.

I'm trying different types of construction, no idea why as I'm not planning to start again or do another layout, the current corner I call stepped where each baseboards is essentially flat and then the foam graded to get the gradient, it's a pain in the butt! I also ended up with 28"r curves which isn't so bad after all.



Having established the basic levels and grade I just threw some insulation board down to get an idea of how the terrain might work, the outside is untouched and will probably go a bit higher, the inside, well I might cut that down a bit more or maybe add a tunnel here, I'm limited in width and more so nearer the corner which is over the heater so I've left a slot at the back for the heat to rise past.



It's messy stuff! but in the end I managed about 3m of basic scenery land mass, the far wall and corner will go higher later.

Having got enough baseboards down to enable a full planned train to be laid out I'm not so sure I have enough space, suddenly even 25 car coal trains look very big, I'd banked on 17' sidings which limits train lengths to about 20 x 50' cars, I'd have to go to 20' for 25 cars so will need to rejig some ideas to achieve that.



There is a switch smack bang in the middle of the far wall so that two tracks come up through the old depot area, this scenery will be less rugged and more flowing. Here I've kept the stepped support work but made the baseboard slope to match the gradient, which is better suited for the planned lower height terrain..



DPU on the bridge and looking up the grade, it's steeper than I wanted but the long flat water level section forces a steeper transition up to the old depot, from there it'll be a steady 2.2 - 2.5% grade hopefully.





Looking back down, the small area in the foreground will be the edge of a water feature, not the same level as the river so more like a mountain pool.



Finally a high altitude view.

When you are sat in the middle, beer in hand and the trains just rolling by, it will be fine.

This is good. Quite similar to ours?

Well the day job is taking a lot of my time and I made a new year resolution to do more layout...and here we are nearly at the end of month three.

I wasn't happy with the baseboards running up to the disused depot (now manned helper station) area, the stepped edged design works well for terrain with elevation spread but not so well for flatter areas. So that corner came and a simple sloped edged section dropped in; it looks better to the eye (but will be covered by fascia at some point so that's mute) and it allowed the road bed to be transfered into a more even grade. I may steepen it a bit to give a more 'humped' approach to the depot area to exaggerate the grade/flat transition type of scenery.

Below, the storage area is done, basically it'll be six tracks wide, all ballast and some ground clutter with warehouse backdrop, a kind of psuedo semi scenic storage area, seems a shame not to do somethig with all that real estate on show. I may well sweep round under the river section for some pure hidden sidings to increase capacity.

The first removable section across the door is in and just needs a small bridging section to the classification yard section to complete, once that's in then the foam trackbed can go down and finally some track laid down and some thought given to signal placement, power and control. Most of the visual main line will be concrete sleepers and the yard will be wooden, I may run one or two of the passing sidings in wood as well just as a visual trigger point.





The Chicago O gauge show Boyz have also been spending my money for me, these'll all get added to a growing collection I have ready for shipping.







Predominately I'm hitting the domestic intermodal 53' stack train items, coal and grain are pretty much complete unit trains now, after that I'll hit the deep sea intermodal which is mostly 40-45' and then the oil train and finally manifests.

I also picked up some decals for units not supplied RTR, primarily Amazon and I'm still looking for UPS and a couple of others. The other must have for modern US Railroads are the mandatory reflective strips applied to all rolling stock, engines either have one long reflective strip (UP generally) or strips (BNSF) on the cill beam; but freight cars have small strips dotted along the side and often have doubles at each end to mark the ends of the car. They used to be white but now I believe yellow is the mandate colour.

Anyway, you can get these from the same place as the Amazon decals and yes, they are reflective but the only downside is they're thicker than decals and are rub down, I'll do a couple of tests and if the thickness offends, just go with yellow non reflective decal strips.

Got all excited for a minute when I thought Amazon were doing decals.....

Rob R said:

Got all excited for a minute when I thought Amazon were doing decals.....

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Actually they do, but not their tradename. Well not Amazon per se, but traders who sell on Amazon have decals for sale.

Scale Trains did some 53' Amazon units, one limited run and then realized they didn't have rights, very rare and hard to find according to several traders I spoke to last year. The only other option are blank 53' boxes and decals, I bought big (enough to cover a big % of a train) in case they go 'off' sale in the future.

Decals should come excise free as they're printed matter, you just need to make sure the sender puts that on the declaration.

I've never paid any excise on decals from the US.

Going to be like Christmas when your next parcel arrives!