Car Paint Discusion (moved from Phill's Workbench)

[oldravendale]

In the Real World, colour varies according to lighting conditions, age, how carefully the paint was applied and how long ago. A rake of coaches in BR maroon would have shown subtle variations in shade for all kinds of reasons. The most convincing models to my eye are often those that show these subtle flaws to perfection - the work of Martyn Welch and Colin Dowling and Fred Lewis, and plenty of others, some of whom can be found on this very forum, fit this bill perfectly.

As a rule, I am happy to buy what the model trade suppliers provide as "authentic" colours. There are some colours - BR coach crimson, for example - which I feel are not quite right, but I don't have personal recollections or good colour reference material to prove it. I try to be consistent with my approach.

You can kind of see why many railway companies adopted black as a livery colour for locos!

Very true, Heather.

In a conversation I had some while ago a proponent was certain that the Met electric locos, in their London Transport days, were painted brown. They never were - always a sort of MR red/maroon, but he could not be convinced. Whether he ever built one of the locos and painted it brown is another colour and, I suppose, he could always say it was a "trick of the light".

Brian

 

[Pugsley]

As modellers we sometimes tend to the obsessive about total accuracy, forgetting that what we do is an art form.

Amen to that!

 

[Pugsley]

Try getting hold of HO scale paint though; then you'll get a funny look

It's the same as O scale paint, but a bit lighter

 

[Heather Kay]

It's the same as O scale paint, but a bit lighter

Half the intensity, presumably.

*gets coat*

 

[Steph Dale]

Half the intensity, presumably.

*gets coat*

Twice the brightness you mean

 

[OzzyO]

Hello Warren, all,

just this morning Steve and I were talking about steam loco blue (lets not say rail blue as I think of the blue that was used after 1965). What we came to think of was that there may have been three blues used.
The first one (1948) had a sort of purple hint to it and was lined out with L.N.W.R. style lining (B.R. mixed traffic).
The second one (approx. 1949) was a "light" blue (RAL 5012?) lined out with L.N.E.R. style lining.
The third one (approx. 1949-50) was a "darker" blue (RAL 5010?) lined out with L.N.E.R. style lining.

When you look at the above spec. sheet it mentions "light" blue, was that too differentiate between the experimental purple/blue and what became the first loco blue? How many express passenger electric locos? Or did this become the blue that the first AC electric locos were painted in?
The blue that Warren has chosen, looks to me a very good choice for the third steam loco blue (looking at photos).

When you get into the "red" end of the spectrum (captain Scarlet, remember them two circles, I've got them outside my house on the road! ) that is a mine field. I've seen colour photos of ex.L.M.S. locos in "red" with "red" stock behind them, that are anything but the same colour as the locos.

I've used "red" to cover all of the names Lake, maroon, etc. etc.

OzzyO.

PS. why have they used a Stanier type cab with a 4F number? Did the bloke just like 4s?

 

[warren haywood]

Ozzy, very interesting, I wasn't aware there were three blues used, only the purple and standard. Maybe that's why the king and the A4 look different.
You may have seen this pic elsewhere but here's my effort at early dark purple blue,





And standard darker blue






Ral 5012 looks very pale almost dare I say it Man City

Cheers Warren

 

[Compton castle]

Warren I think you have both colours spot on, the purple shade does not get seen enough,
I think that the later blue had differences, maybe it was different ways the paint was mixed or how it wore down in service. I've seen pictures of a king in a much lighter shade.
It's a pity the blue didn't last longer as I do like it.

 

[warren haywood]

Steve, I remember seeing a Duchess painted in pale blue, I think it was Caledonian sky blue and looked wrong. All early colour pictures I have seen of standard blue look quite dark but this could be down to early film or weathering. There is a famous picture of Duchess of Athol ex works and she looks almost navy blue.
We could go on forever over the correct shade, if there is one, possibly Scottish works had supplies of Caledonian or blue they needed to use up, Crewe might have had some left over from the blue streamliners and so on.
I think that's the blue talked about enough now, how about a discussion on LMS, Midland Crimson lake and BR maroon but please leave me out of that one !!!!

 

[Overseer]

I think now is about the right time to lob a grenade

Whilst I appreciate that BS381C/114 is the actual colour for Rail Blue, wouldn't a model painted that colour look too dark? In my opinion, the colours for use on models should be lighter than the true shade, due to the scale effect.

Isn't scale effect used to make faux snake skin boots?

Seriously though I have never been convinced that lightening colours on models is a good idea. I always try to match the actual colours as closely as possible because models are looked at from close up as well as from a distance - if you reduce the intensity, or fade, colours they will not look right when viewed or photographed up close. The colour temperature of the lights the model is viewed under will have more effect on the apparent colour. Recent advances in LED and compact fluorescent lighting mean that it is now much easier to choose lighting to show models at their best.