Hairy Bikers and Other Petrol Heads

simond

Western Thunderer
No, I agree, back in the 70’s me and my pals were on sub 500cc bikes though I knew a couple of guys with 650/750s. We never worried about wheel failure. Or much else to be fair.

The story re the BMWs is that the rear brake caliper may have become entangled in the wheel. Suggestions made about dodgy (home) maintenance. No, we didn’t worry about that either. The Guzzi story was more concerning, and the guy seemed pretty switched on.

I’ll dig out the links for anyone who’s keen to scare themselves…

(the GS is theoretically capable of giving me 136bhp.)

atb
Simon
 

simond

Western Thunderer
these are not pretty viewing



no video of this one

 

Eastsidepilot

Western Thunderer
these are not pretty viewing



no video of this one

Reminds me a bit of the front tyre I had blow out on me, ran over what I can only describe as a big piece of shrapnel !
 

King Crab

Western Thunderer
A Question for more experienced metal bashers than me.
I'm trying to resuscitate my 1960 MGA hardtop as it has been sitting for the last 20 years while other things got in the way.
Anyway I tried to shift it the other day to get a better look, and the wheels just won't turn.
Checked the handbrake etc. Jacked it up and removed the rear wheel and the brake drum isn't rotating.
I slackened off the brake adjuster, removed all the bolts and gave it a few good bashes with a hammer, no luck.
Any thoughts on how to get it off?
Maybe some heat, like a blowtorch or something?

Peter
 

mswjr

Western Thunderer
i had a similar problem with a Rover that had been stood in my garage for about the same time, It was the clutch stuck on, I put the rear on axle stands, started her up, Then hit the brakes , That was enough to free it.
 

simond

Western Thunderer
A Question for more experienced metal bashers than me.
I'm trying to resuscitate my 1960 MGA hardtop as it has been sitting for the last 20 years while other things got in the way.
Anyway I tried to shift it the other day to get a better look, and the wheels just won't turn.
Checked the handbrake etc. Jacked it up and removed the rear wheel and the brake drum isn't rotating.
I slackened off the brake adjuster, removed all the bolts and gave it a few good bashes with a hammer, no luck.
Any thoughts on how to get it off?
Maybe some heat, like a blowtorch or something?

Peter
A blowtorch would be a long way down my list, due to the rubber, plastic, oil, whatever hiding in there. The brake shoe linings will surely be a) asbestos, and b) rusted to the drums. You might want to wear eye, and dust protection.

the drums are almost certainly made of cast iron, so getting brutal with them is going to end in replacement.

I’m assuming there’s no movement of either rear wheel relative to the axle?

if you’re not able to work around it, you’ll need some bogies or a dolly or something on which to shift it.

I would jack up, get it on some serious supports (not £10 Halfords special offer) and remove or release the linkages to the hand brake. if you can get a screwdriver into the drum, you might be able to free the linkage. You can hopefully also back off the adjusters, and remove the screws that hold the drum on.

Make or otherwise obtain a means of applying some leverage: a bit of tube with a metal plate welded to it, and bolted to the hub where the wheel would normally fit. If it’s wire wheels, that might be more of a challenge. If the tube is a good three or four feet long, you can get some serious leverage, which you should try both forwards and reverse. I’m assuming the rear brakes were single leading, single trailing, with an opposed piston brake cylinder, and the handbrake working off the fulcrum, so working it both ways will tend to loosen one shoe whilst grabbing the other, and vice versa.

If the foot brake still holds pressure, try repeatedly operating it, whilst a pal works the lever.

with a bit of luck and some repeated efforts…

I guess one of those hot air paint strippers might be a good idea. Not too hot, but enough to expand the drum a little, again, repeated efforts.

Patience will hopefully eventually be rewarded by removable drums, and nothing broken. Good luck!
 

alastairq

Western Thunderer
As a user of old vehicles, and not having a gucci garage, I never leave a vehicle parked with its handbrake applied. Simply leaving the ting in gear, or simply using chox.
Clutches are far easier to free off.
If worse comes to worst, spray oil into the drums, and budget for a new set of linings?
After all, one wouldn't be expecting to have working brakes after all that freeing-off, would one? [Probably, at the very least, fluid will need changing? More likely if any rubber in brake cylinder has either hardened or perished?
Girling{?} mechanical brakes are far easier to free & renovate...and use, than any of that fancy high-draw-licks stuff, anyway...
 

Osgood

Western Thunderer
If there is an inspection hole to monitor lining wear it is sometimes possible to get a punch in and whack the shoe hard, but slack adjuster must be wound off.
Another trick that in desperation sometimes works ( smiley sweat.gif) is to unbolt the hydraulic cylinder.

Alternatively (and I note you've freed off the slack adjuster) just keep hitting the drum - heavy copper hammer is great for this - after somewhere between 4 and 400 whacks it will surely give up :D
 

Max M

Western Thunderer
If is is the handbrake pivot that has seized then applying a mixture of ATF (Auto transmission fluid) and diesel which makes a good penetrating oil.
Alternatively make a plate that will bolt to the hub to which you can attach a slide hammer.
 

simond

Western Thunderer
If is is the handbrake pivot that has seized then applying a mixture of ATF (Auto transmission fluid) and diesel which makes a good penetrating oil.
Alternatively make a plate that will bolt to the hub to which you can attach a slide hammer.
Slide hammer is damn useful, I wish I still had mine, but you'll have to remove the nuts on the ends of the half shafts first!

(at under 90 quid, that looks quite a handy bit of kit)
 

King Crab

Western Thunderer
Wow. Plenty of good suggestions there. All very gratefully received.

I am posting some images from my Haynes manual.
1 I never park it with the handbrake on in the garage, as my Dad told me long ago.
2 The drum fits over four studs as you can see in the image, with the axle cover boss protruding at the centre.
I did try levering it in the space between the drum and the backplate, but the backplate just flexed.
3 I did imagine some sort of three legged spider grabber that would hook/fasten on the outer rim of the drum and stand off the central boss, if that makes sense? Or a small jack with some arms pulling on the drum.....Not sure what you would call it.

Peter



MGA.BRAKE.DRUM.jpgMGA.BRAKE.DRUM.2.jpg
 

simond

Western Thunderer
That’s helpful! I think you have two options before getting destructive.

You can either try to turn the drums as I initially suggested, with a big lever fixed to the hub. Lots of clockwise & anti-clockwise grunt with the adjusters backed off, if you can access them. (Difficult if the hole is on the drum, easier if a hex head on the back of the backplate)

Alternatively, Max’ suggestion of trying to extract the drum and hub with a slide hammer might bear fruit. To do this, you will probably wreck the wheel bearings, and you must take the cap off the hub (picture 2.5) and remove the split pin, nut and washer before bolting the thingy to the hub, and giving it the beans with the slide hammer.

maybe a bit of both? Slide. Hammer on Thursdays, Saturdays and Mondays, big lever on Fridays, Sundays, etc..

and a bit of heat, just not too much!
 

simond

Western Thunderer
Is there a countersunk head screw holding the drum on?

You have removed it - haven't you?
There is, in picture 2.5. I believe there are two. They hold the drum to the hub.

Not sure why, as the wheelnuts do the same job. I’d bet a pound that the wheel studs have a fat mushroom head, and are splined into the hub from the inside.

Its not the reason why it won’t turn though!
 

Max M

Western Thunderer
Wow. Plenty of good suggestions there. All very gratefully received.

I am posting some images from my Haynes manual.
1 I never park it with the handbrake on in the garage, as my Dad told me long ago.
2 The drum fits over four studs as you can see in the image, with the axle cover boss protruding at the centre.
I did try levering it in the space between the drum and the backplate, but the backplate just flexed.
3 I did imagine some sort of three legged spider grabber that would hook/fasten on the outer rim of the drum and stand off the central boss, if that makes sense? Or a small jack with some arms pulling on the drum.....Not sure what you would call it.
What you are describing is a three legged puller...no I don't know how they think of these names either.

Forgive me if you already know this, but to use such a beasty the centre bolt needs to be tightened until it is hard to turn and the you hit it with a hammer. It's this that (hopfully) releases the built up tension in the puller and the item comes off. It may be a case of tighten,bash, tighten, bash and 'walk' the hub off.
If you do choose to go this route buy a puller with a substantial spider, centre bolt and legs. Lightweight jobbing have a lot of flex in them as the centre bolt is tightened and they effectively become a big spring.
 

King Crab

Western Thunderer
There seems to be quite a range of prices on Amazon at least.
Plus I think I'm trying to do the opposite of what the thing is built for.
Not punch out something from the centre, but pull off something at the edges.
Peter

THREE LEG PULLER.png
 

Osgood

Western Thunderer
Those pullers both pull at the edges and push at the centre so you could say they are true dual purpose :D
 
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