North London Railway Class 51 4-4-0T

Discussion in 'S7 Group' started by Michael D, 16 November 2017.

  1. garethashenden

    garethashenden Active Member

    I hope this helps with your project. The backhead isn't too clear, but it gives some cab details. Additionally, Iain Rice built an open cabbed version in the '80s and wrote it up. He included a couple of drawings, one of which was his conjecture as to the cab fittings. I have a copy somewhere, I'll track it down in the morning.
    class 51-1.jpg
    Yorkshire Dave likes this.
  2. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Hi Gareth, thank you, yes thats the plan ive been working to, The Rice article was useful but its a bit guesswork?
    hope youre well, lots been happening since we were last in touch, ill send you a message!

    One thing im not sure about is the height of the cab footplate, theres different opinions that the splasher height was the floor and or three was a step down onto the cab floor, I guess all will become clear when the casting for the backhead arrives.
    Certainly doing this in S7 reduces compromises on frame and splasher spacing and has been well worth it.......
    best wishes
    daifly and Wagonman like this.
  3. garethashenden

    garethashenden Active Member

  4. john lewsey

    john lewsey Western Thunderer

    Hi Gareth there are some lovely photos there
  5. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    And then... I know this is an outside cylinder but they dont look like they are standing on a dropped floor? With the splasher height it still leaves a good 6' headroom???? also if they were on the footplate/running plate height they wouldn't see out out of the front window, it might suggest the floor was raised looking where the loco controls are in relation as well??? Who knows I guess is the answer..... loco back.jpg
    Yorkshire Dave and john lewsey like this.
  6. Obblygobbly

    Obblygobbly Active Member

    Looking at the drawing, there appears to be a 7ft 6in dimension from the top of the footplate to the underside of the cab roof. Why show that dimension, unless it was the height of the inside of the cab? Also, the bottom of the firebox door appears to be well below the level of the splasher top. There would surely have to be a low floor in the middle of the cab to access it and to open the firebox door?
    Andrew and Michael D like this.
  7. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Indeed and that probably settles it as far as I can see. Different pictures at different angles, cross checking plans with subclasses of 2 variations of cabs possible, short cabs, long cabs,3 rebuilds in their history all adds to the fun....
  8. john lewsey

    john lewsey Western Thunderer

    Lovely photo I quite like that loco
  9. Tim Watson

    Tim Watson Western Thunderer

    It also generates biblical quantities of fluff, which is not good for the ‘proper’ model railway scales.

  10. Yorkshire Dave

    Yorkshire Dave Western Thunderer

    Judging by the photo in post #25 above the driver (facing the photographer) is standing on the cab floor and the fireman has propped himself up on the splasher cover as you can see his foot resting there.

    I would expect the splasher cover to be at the most one foot wide as the crew have to step over this. A similar situation can be seen in the Beattie well tank below:

    Michael D likes this.
  11. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    I found myself in York over the weekend so thought it worth a look at the 1/8th model they have,built at Bow Works by the apprentices so heres the answer to the cab conundrum.Im guessing although this is the narrower cab version it would have to have been the same setup, and its back to the drawing board with the backhead,just like the tank fillers the NLR had to be different with the firebox door! There were several variations in sub class and rebuilds over the years for these real terriers of suburban commuter locos apart from the inside outside cylinders. But the outside one is for another day, the Park 0-6-0 goods tank is on the drawing board with the frames ready to go as a little distraction..... 20180405_151014_resized.jpg 20180405_150344_resized.jpg
  12. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    You just needed a little more faith ;) - that is the arrangement shown on the GA. Although not obvious it is a true section through the locomotive so the thick line through the cab base is the floor.

    And that 1/8 model is an absolute beauty. With so much of the collection not on public display I'd say you were remarkably lucky to find it both out and accessible. I do wonder if that fireman's side sander handle has got knocked around though...

    As an aside, those cab fittings look very much like those used for Adams locos. I suspect you'll find most of them fairly readily available if you take some care with selection.

  13. garethashenden

    garethashenden Active Member

    Is it just a reflection or is the inside of the cab dark red?
  14. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Definitely dark red Gareth, including the back of the cab
    Best wishes
  15. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Afternoon all, I thought I should take a slight diversion away from loco matters and so Bow Wagon Works has been quite active, by the magic of some lolly sticks,plasticard,brass, the works drawings and my trusty kitchen table, theres now a very presentable 1870's dumb buffered coal wagon from our local coal merchants of old on the Caledonian Road and to keep it company an old short NLR Brake Van
    best wishes Michael 20180418_171810_resized.jpg
  16. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer


    Just flicking through a couple of magazines, I came across this picture which I thought might be useful to you:
    New Doc 2018-04-22_1.jpg
    (Image courtesy NRM, reproduced here for educational use)

    Michael D likes this.
  17. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Thanks Steph, thats a new one for me, I sorted out the inside of the cab, splashers and floor finally!
    best Michael
  18. Michael D

    Michael D Western Thunderer

    Evening all,
    So ABC gears delivered a rather fabulous gearbox today, so with great trepidation I spent the afternoon fitting and playing with pick-ups, took a deep breath and low and behold it works!
    One of those super moments in our wonderful hobby, my first Scratchbuilt effort is coming to life!
    So will have to crack on with the rest of the chassis detailing now, and try and get it presentable for its next outing to the Reading Show (ALSRM?) in a couple of weekends
    all best Michael

  19. Steph Dale

    Steph Dale Western Thunderer

    Marvellous, I love it when a plan comes together!

    Michael D likes this.
  20. adrian

    adrian Flying Squad

    Fantastic, it is a good achievement. Although to be honest my heart was in my mouth watching the test run. I'm not sure I'd have been brave enough to try a test run without a couple of end plates on the test track.