Dave Sutton
Active Member
I reckon you'll have to shorten those black and red pick ups....
Wantage Tramway Jane No. 5 in 4mm
- Thread starter AdeMoore
- Start date
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
I wanted some slack Dave! Ha ha you’re a tease ……….I reckon you'll have to shorten those black and red pick ups....
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Not running great and it could be a number of things!
When I ran it as just a chassis pushed by the jinty I had to open out the bush holes in the rods to get it to run.
the hornblocks dont have guides as such and can twist away from vertical in their larger than expected slots.
The axles could do with cleaning up no Lubrication on the axles.
I’ll try the easy things first.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
ummm well what happened was! When I pushed the chassis with the Jinty I resorted to opening up the coupling rod bush holes to make it run!
I now realise that was not wise!
So should I shim them out with brass to the right size, scrap them and start again or something else?
The coupling rods should set the axle centres I read but it was too late back then when I was starting out I‘d gone off the template.
Also the nuts on the front pair I filed down for clearance came loose so they came off to see what was what.
I need to investigate the reverse crank pin set up any photos or pointers to suppliers would be welcome.
I had to put the box and label there to get the mobile to focus in the van!
Cheers for looking in.
Just a few tags for those who have helped previously!
@Dave Sutton @adrian @simond @Robin @Ian@StEnochs @Overseer thanks in advance.
I now realise that was not wise!
So should I shim them out with brass to the right size, scrap them and start again or something else?
The coupling rods should set the axle centres I read but it was too late back then when I was starting out I‘d gone off the template.
Also the nuts on the front pair I filed down for clearance came loose so they came off to see what was what.
I need to investigate the reverse crank pin set up any photos or pointers to suppliers would be welcome.
I had to put the box and label there to get the mobile to focus in the van!
Cheers for looking in.
Just a few tags for those who have helped previously!
@Dave Sutton @adrian @simond @Robin @Ian@StEnochs @Overseer thanks in advance.
Last edited:
John Hutnick
New Member
The best system to set the holes is a little work, and more or less needs a lathe.
Take out the drivers. Make 2 replacement axles with the ends turned to crankpin diameter.
Take(or make) your 4 crank bushings and place on these axle ends.
Make holes in the siderods big enough to easily slide over the bushings. Then solder the bushings securely in the siderods.
In theory, you are now done.
You may wish to just start over siderods using N/S scrap from etchings.
Take out the drivers. Make 2 replacement axles with the ends turned to crankpin diameter.
Take(or make) your 4 crank bushings and place on these axle ends.
Make holes in the siderods big enough to easily slide over the bushings. Then solder the bushings securely in the siderods.
In theory, you are now done.
You may wish to just start over siderods using N/S scrap from etchings.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Thanks for the reply John no lathe here! The most basic of basic set ups all handrolic!
Im thinking make up the original jig again.
shim out the holes with brass to the pins, solder then drill out as a pair each end for the bush.
what do you think?
Lyndhurstman
Western Thunderer
Hello @AdeMoore
Obviously the biggest issue is getting the axle centres accurately transferred to the coupling rods. This is not easy. This is the way I did it on the Y4:
Post in thread 'Jan's 4mm Workbench'
4mm - Jan's 4mm Workbench
If you were building this from a kit, then the frames would be built up using the rods as datum, If with some alignment jigs from London Road Models or Markits
http://traders.scalefour.org/LondonRoadModels/images/alignmentjig.jpg. There is another (better) version that has parallel ends the same size as crankpin bearings, but I don’t know where you can get them. In your application, these - used in conjunction with a tapered broach - might be handy in getting the connecting rod pitch the same as that of the chassis. The broach would maintain the concentricity of the hole and prevent it becoming oval - which would introduce binding.
So really - for me - it’s whether you can find some way to rework the pitch of the holes accurately.
Failing all that, i would start again, and open out the holes in the rods incrementally with small drills, ending with a tapered broach to maintain concentricity.
Cheers
Jan
Paul Tomlinson
Western Thunderer
Poppy's Wood Tech supply these with their Builder Boxes - in 1/8" and 3/16"
Dave Sutton
Active Member
ooooh difficult one. I was able to build the frames and bearings with the rods in a jig.
Have you got any overlong axles/rod? You need to check if the bearings in the frames are parallel. I'll have a look in the 'bits' box and see if I've got anything, I moved house a while ago and we're in a rental while I build our new one so it may take a bit of time to find. I'll also look to see if there are any spares left.
Have you got any overlong axles/rod? You need to check if the bearings in the frames are parallel. I'll have a look in the 'bits' box and see if I've got anything, I moved house a while ago and we're in a rental while I build our new one so it may take a bit of time to find. I'll also look to see if there are any spares left.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Thanks for all for the replies Jan I was looking in on the Y4 thread thanks.
Paul 1 & 2 ! Thanks.
I have seen the Poppys jig before and was tempted thanks.
Dave ever kind but let’s see if I can sort it before you go putting yourself out as you always kindly do.
What I used 1/4 inch drill bits when doing the hornblocks seemed ok. I have a spare pair of rods in the band new etch you sent me If I need.
I was thinking if I get a pair of rods identical. Then I need a pair of those guides as seen in the Poppys jig above, put the rods in the chassis and solder up the hornblock guides to suit. There are none at present they just float in the chassis slots I made for them.
Seems not a good idea by eye so need a jig!
I’ll refer back to a few threads for ideas.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Ah now where were we! time flies.
1st thing I bought a poppies jig. So that’s a positive move.
Reason for the lengthy absence is two fold one I was cracking on with the layout after a big dip in the mojo as the company I worked for for 18 years was sold out to a big outfit only interested in shareholders and growth, where as it had always been a smallish family firm. That did nothing for me, so at 60 I was looking for another job, a tough road to travel. Two the layout had to be dismantled to accommodate son and partner and grandson and dog who moved in while their house had a major extension built.
Now with a new company and getting to grips with that, son and partner now in their newly extended house thoughts returned to modelling.
I’d been mulling this one over had the poppies jig for Xmas 2023. I bought some broaches they do need handles adding though.
First up a no more modelling in the van only 30 mins lunch break at the new company which isn’t long enough to be useful. So a new modelling room which was many years ago my daughters bedroom! Still has her pink walls must address that! More recently since about 2016 it has been my home office, but no more working from home so it could be repurposed.
A few Xmas goodies there a Clarke tool cabinet and a Tamiya paint rack.
Right on to Jane.
I’m gonna give the old rods a go!
I broached out the holes for a fit of some brass tube I had with a tiny bore that will need reaming out to take the crankpin sleeves? Not sure what they are called now without trolling back through the thread.
Not sure best way to cut off the brass a fine blade in my saw I’m thinking.
Next the chassis the horn blocks have no guides! The slots are over size there’s a lot of movement!
As can be seen from those photos above.
All needs a good clean too. Do I forget the springing and solder it all up or persevere with someway of sorting it!
Currently I’m thinking epoxy some plastikard or brass either side of the block to keep it in place.
Until next time hopefully less than 2 years!
Cheers..
1st thing I bought a poppies jig. So that’s a positive move.
Reason for the lengthy absence is two fold one I was cracking on with the layout after a big dip in the mojo as the company I worked for for 18 years was sold out to a big outfit only interested in shareholders and growth, where as it had always been a smallish family firm. That did nothing for me, so at 60 I was looking for another job, a tough road to travel. Two the layout had to be dismantled to accommodate son and partner and grandson and dog who moved in while their house had a major extension built.
Now with a new company and getting to grips with that, son and partner now in their newly extended house thoughts returned to modelling.
I’d been mulling this one over had the poppies jig for Xmas 2023. I bought some broaches they do need handles adding though.
First up a no more modelling in the van only 30 mins lunch break at the new company which isn’t long enough to be useful. So a new modelling room which was many years ago my daughters bedroom! Still has her pink walls must address that! More recently since about 2016 it has been my home office, but no more working from home so it could be repurposed.
A few Xmas goodies there a Clarke tool cabinet and a Tamiya paint rack.
Right on to Jane.
I’m gonna give the old rods a go!
I broached out the holes for a fit of some brass tube I had with a tiny bore that will need reaming out to take the crankpin sleeves? Not sure what they are called now without trolling back through the thread.
Not sure best way to cut off the brass a fine blade in my saw I’m thinking.
Next the chassis the horn blocks have no guides! The slots are over size there’s a lot of movement!
As can be seen from those photos above.
All needs a good clean too. Do I forget the springing and solder it all up or persevere with someway of sorting it!
Currently I’m thinking epoxy some plastikard or brass either side of the block to keep it in place.
Until next time hopefully less than 2 years!
Cheers..
Paul Tomlinson
Western Thunderer
When I bushed my rods, I sliced off the tube with a piercing saw, leaving a small stub, then drew the rods along a fine flat file until the join was almost invisible.
Re. the hornways, Comet hornblocks require a slot 5.85mm wide - any good? Otherwise I'd solder in a compact hornblock & guide from High Level. Best of luck.
Re. the hornways, Comet hornblocks require a slot 5.85mm wide - any good? Otherwise I'd solder in a compact hornblock & guide from High Level. Best of luck.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Cheers Paul for the info. Yes great idea RE the rods on a fine flat file. I now remember I actually have the hornways! /guides for the hornblocks I bought 25 plus years ago. I wonder if I can find them!
Dave Sutton
Active Member
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana...Good to see you back.
IIRC I was given a measurement for the horn blocks as I'd not used them. I did mine as a straightforward rigid chassis without problems (OO) I'm not 100% sure but I think Robin Gay (Rolvenden and Wantage layouts) also did his rigid in P4.
She is a tricky wee beastie but you've done good so far.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Cheers Dave amazing your still tuning in after all these years! Thanks for the advice.
If I can’t spring it a rigid it will be.
AdeMoore
Western Thunderer
Cheers Jon thanks as always for your support and advice along the way.