Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
This is the second one of these kits that I've built. I didn't pay enough attention to the roof on the first only and the joints still annoy me. So this one has had a lot more filling and smoothing work done.
I don't believe it's possible to laser cut the roof in one piece and can see why Phil has gone for the approach he has. In my mind the roof would suit a single resin casting or a 3d print better, but that takes you into the territory of a potentially more expensive mixed media kit.
My personal observation is that 7mm is far more loco/stock centric than say 4mm or 2mm, and that buildings and scenics are often far down the interest scale. As such I suspect the current kit suits the vast majority of 7mm modellers interest level and there's probably not much value in amending it.
I'm weird in that I want to apply consistent standards and attention to detail across the board. The roof does bother me and I'm addressing it on my model. Even with this extra work, it's still significantly quicker than scratchbuilding, and the kit builds into a sturdy model.
I've not really had much experience of laser cut kits before and the conclusion I'm coming to is that they can be a great shortcut to getting you a good 80-90% of the way to the finished model. Just like any kit you are free to add detail, amend or replace parts to suit. I don't see this as an issue, but then again I usually scratchbuild buildings.
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Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
Hi ken, is this in the right thread?
mickoo
Western Thunderer
The issue is (from my limited exposure) that consumers expect cottage industry kits/extas/addons to fit like Tamiya, Hasegawa, Airfix etc.
I get the same with 3D bits I produce, you mean I have to clean the support marks off?!
Yet the very same people will spend hours cleaning flash off white metal and brass castings and decusping etches....go figure.
What ever the medium, some post processing is to be expected, the only difference is how much, the better the product the less post processing is required, generally.
Regarding this project, I'd concur with the build process on the laminated roof, any other way would require the three sections of roof having to be blended at the two joins (again post processing). Personally (if I wanted to keep to a similar material) I'd have explored a cardboard overlay and blended the edges, but knowing my penchant for 3D I would almost certainly have 3D printed the roof and chimney and moved on with life.
Intentio could 3D print the roof but given it's size and shape would be difficult to print without some sort of warping, smart orientation would limit that (to almost nil with luck) but would push up the print time drastically and thus throughput/cost/expense. Given your observation on 7mm centric (which I agree with) that'd place the price outside of the 'I'm comfortable' buy bracket.
mickoo
Western Thunderer
As an extra aside, we (the 7mm community from my observations) really need to get over this hurdle/mental blockage.
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
Thanks Mick, agree with your comments.
It will get primed later to see what the surface comes out like. I do wonder if slightly lower roof sections and a card overlay might be a better solution for less modelling work. I am however happy to do a bit of graft on kits I buy to finish them off.
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
Agree again. Every material is more suitable than others in certain circumstances. Mixed media kits playing to each materials strengths is the way to go. However, mixed media = multiple processes = increased costs for a manufacturer.
I think most of the cottage industries grow up around someone getting good at, and spending money on the kit for, a single media. So you see kits that are either etched, cast, printed or cut, but seldom a mixture. You could of course subcontract parts to other specialists but then you increase the supply chain and have a dependency on others.
Not an easy world for the cottage industries, particularly as modellers seem to want the best for little cost.
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
I have an idea….
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
I think that’s probably a bit unfair. It really isn’t much effort to get the roof looking good and filling really isn’t required to make it decent. Chris will always push the envelope and he has here gone the extra for a perfect finish and especially as I didn’t give him enough parts!
timbowales
Western Thunderer
Jonte, consider what you say, especially as the manufacturer is a WT member.
Just saying
jonte
Western Thunderer
I should have hoped it would have been received as constructive criticism, but perceptions are thus.
I suppose it all depends on the cost aspect. Pocket money kits, well, one can’t complain if a little extra effort/materials are required, however - and respectfully- Intentio products ain’t cheap, and so need to go together with ease, all parts being provided.
Just my take, for what it’s worth.
jonte
jonte
Western Thunderer
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
Is it a cunning plan?
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
The intentio kit the same price as the recently released Dapol Kitmaster card kit. I note that even in the adverts the Dapol kit has poor joints on the roof and is less detailed.
The intentio kit while not perfect but is assembled as intended and just painted. No filling but a light go over with wet and dry sandpaper.
I do have an idea to try out but I think it will just be moving the problem around rather than curing the need to do some modelling.
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
Probably jumping the gun with ill deserved confidence in my ability…
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
If everyone builds kits straight out of the bag exactly as intended then everyone will end up with the same model on their layout. You end up with layout after layout at exhibitions all with the same generic look. This is particularly prevalent in 00 and the over use of the card kits widely available.
I have always treated a scenic kit as a starting point, and a time saver. To me the best ones are those you can easily adapt, change and make your own. The SR Provender Store is a classic example - whilst building it I instantly started thinking how it could be adapted to make different sizes of store. A lot of that comes down to how it's been designed by Phil.
I also love looking at prototype photos and spotting additional detail to add. This is often small bits that add to the picture and make the model different or 'lived in'. I'm under no illusions that my interests are vastly different to the majority of 7mm modellers and there's simply no point in including in a kit detail or features that are of no interest, are too fine for some to fit or that will get broken off on the layout.
For me, as long as the kit is dimensionally correct and looks like the prototype, I'm happy to use it as a short cut to getting to the same point as scratch building, and then spend time adding the extras. Time is something I really struggle with, so is most precious. I was shocked how quickly these kits have gone together compared to my usual scratchbuilds. There's no way I would have had one building finished, let alone four nearing completion.
All the kits I've made so far have have been sent to me by Phil knowing full well I'll have one eye at seeing what extra I can do and add. That I play with and adjust them doesn't make them bad kits, just good ones that have potential to be further worked on. I've given Phil some feedback and ideas on some bits, which in many cases he's taken on board, but some thoughts definitely go into the perfect world / cost no issue territory. That's totally understandable on the price vs sales equation.
All these kits can be build and finished as intended straight out of the box. I chose not to, and seldom do when it comes to following the script. I'm quietly hoping that showing that it's perfectly acceptable to deviate from the script, others will also have a go and use a little observation and imagination to make something different.
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
I think on balance I'd leave as is.
I only really started with more filler than normal as I had to merge in my bodgery using scraps and offcuts to fill the hole left by the missing parts. My reasoning was that if I fill part of the roof, I might as well do the rest for a uniform finish.
Filling and sanding isn't an issue. After all we'd give the joints of a wooden baseboard kit the once over with the sandpaper... All part of making stuff.
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timbowales
Western Thunderer
Having read this thread I'm about to order a 4mm GWR Platelayer hut
Pencarrow
Western Thunderer
No worries.sorry Chris , just carried on from my comment on your build