Prototype Tim Mills' Photos

76043

Western Thunderer
Interesting to see the lads tape recording the departure, I was doing the same in 1963/64 so now I have 49 3" tapes featuring recordings recorded at 1 7/8 ips all 150 minutes (you can do the maths!) around Northampton plus some special trains (Castle, County etc) Duchess over Beattock,

So nice to see lads recording the departure, I was doing exactly the same in 1963/64 instead of taking photographs and am able to 'relive' many great memories in sound.
Have you digitised them and thought of their future after you are gone? A bit grim, but they sound, excuse the pun, well worth saving for posterity. You probably already have thought of this.
Tony
 

Genghis

Western Thunderer
70010 was one of the few Brits that I remember seeing - on shed at one of the Crewe depots in 66 or 67. The reason I remember it so vividly was the renditions of the name being different on the smoke deflectors. The other ones that spring to mind are 70045 passing my school during induction day in 1966, causing the headmaster to lament that the only problem with the then brand new school buildings was the location next to the Gloucester - Cheltenham 4 track railway. The only other one I remember is 70049 entering Crewe station from the north on a Royal Mail Train, wheels locked as it tried to bring the train under control. First time I had seen Sorting Coaches, which in the maroon livery were a joy to behold.

Happy Days!

David
 

46240

Member
Good afternoon Brian,

Very interesting to see the March -allocated K3 working through Witham on a Class C train.

I acquired a kit-built K3 last year as part of an estate sale, which was also a March-allocated loco.
Spookily enough I fitted Class C lamps, imagining it working fruit/van trains from East Anglia.
So, seeing it on a parcels working gives me another option.

Keep the inspiration coming please.

Cheers, Nigel.
 

simond

Western Thunderer
Have you digitised them and thought of their future after you are gone? A bit grim, but they sound, excuse the pun, well worth saving for posterity. You probably already have thought of this.
Tony
In my teens, a pal, Neil, & I were taken by his dad, Gordon Kennedy, to Diggle & Halebarns, Ken Longbottom’s magnificent garden railway. All the regulars were Gordon’s age, I guess, but we were accepted and trusted with the responsibility of signalling and running trains, and became regular operators. Ken was a screaming eccentric, hilarious company, and an excellent tutor, and I learnt much about signalling from him. His memory is etched in my mind, a burned-through ciggy on the lower lip (he always had a ciggy on, he just didn’t actually seem to smoke it) and an impish grin.

One of the features of Halebarns station, which became a through station when Westport was built, was the sound effects. Gordon had recorded, or had obtained recordings of, appropriate whistles, chuffs and clangs, and had, by virtue of Ken’s electrickery, aided by Meccano, springs, Auntie Mary* relays wire coat hangers and inventiveness, arranged to play these back as loops when the express went through.

*Auntie Mary, aka the Air Ministry provided all sorts of useful surplus, including relays, and those lovely grey ball raced 9-pole 24V motors. (The definition of “surplus” might depend on the person doing the defining.)

There was a shelf of old reel-to-reel tape recorders under the layout, which were triggered by treadles and interlocked with the signals, and which played the impatient driver at the home signal, the enthusiastic driver at the starter or the prolonged howl of the through express.

It’s more than fifty years ago, the memories are still rattling around!

I visited once after Ken had died, but haven’t been back for twenty-some, indeed, maybe thirty years. I heard that the layout had fallen into disrepair, which is sad. I wonder what happened to it all.

Anyway, to return to Brian’s thread, I did look at the recordists, and they don’t look like (my memories of) Gordon. But if anyone has such recordings, maybe digitising them, and linking them on the resources section of WT, might be a gift to the future, as well as the present.

atb
Simon
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Re #3907/8 I can add some info. The three doll bracket at the country end of the up platform was provided by the LNER, in 1923 the arrangements there were different. I don't understand why the RH doll has a different cap to the other two, perhaps the original got broken. The three arms were from L to R, from Up Main starting to Down Main, from Up Main starting to Maldon, from Up Back starting to Maldon. The two dollies are for shunt moves from their respective lines. The first two of these along with the pile of redundant rodding etc lying on the platform are preparatory works in connection with the resignalling of Witham with single aspect searchlight signals which was commissioned on 19/11/61. At that time the connection that had allowed trains from Maldon to run into the up Main platform was removed.

There was also a signal box at Blunts Hall that was closed on 17/9/61.
 

Michael Hall

Western Thunderer
Have you digitised them and thought of their future after you are gone? A bit grim, but they sound, excuse the pun, well worth saving for posterity. You probably already have thought of this.
Tony
Thank you for your reply Tony and yes I have thought of this and to this end bought a mains tape recorder a few years ago to play the recordings back and catalogue them, a job now done. I had hoped to transfer the 'best' of them to CD but the technology eludes me for the moment. Pretty well all of this material is unrepeatable - Bath Green Park to Evercreech Jn, Duchess of Rutland over Beattock, Manor on the down Cambrian Coast Express and so much more. Perhaps I should redouble my efforts........thanks for your interest Tony.
 

Bob Essex

Western Thunderer
I don’t know what connections your tape recorder has but you used to be able to get equipment to connect up to a PC and digitally record sound files. I used to do this with adapter stuff produced by Roland for vinyl and cassette tapes but whether such options still exist is open to question.

Bob
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
I had hoped to transfer the 'best' of them to CD

That's a start, but it’s sadly unlikely to be a permanent solution. Even the allegedly indestructible compact disc has proven to be mortal, and self-recorded discs are perhaps the most vulnerable to failing. Even the oxides on tapes will fail. How ironic that a superseded medium like the good old vinyl disc will probably outlast its replacements in the end!

Keeping the files in a "standard" digital format on hard drives, or increasingly solid state drives, seems the safest option - but ensuring they are backed up in several places, and regularly checked for integrity. Let’s not even begin to consider which formats, standard today, might not even be readable in a few years.

I have an interest in audio recording, though my stuff has been much more recent and recorded digitally. I don’t know where to safely archive such files for posterity, so I upload them to my YouTube channel in the first instance. Who knows how long that site will continue, but it isn’t showing any signs of disappearing just yet.
 
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Barry37

Western Thunderer
There’s got to be more than one - the Skidmores/Scudamores of Kentchurch in Herefordshire are descended from a daughter, but that’s by the by. Mum was at Aber’ a year or so after Charles had been and gone, and that sounds like a plausible tale of that period…

NB, for reasons of sentiment, were I ever to model a Brit’ it would be 70010 at the end of its life. It’s pretty unlikely!

Adam

That's a start, but it’s sadly unlikely to be a permanent solution. Even the allegedly indestructible compact disc has proven to be mortal, and self-recorded discs are perhaps the most vulnerable to failing. Even the oxides on tapes will fail. How ironic that a superseded medium like the good old vinyl disc will probably outlast its replacements in the end!

Keeping the files in a "standard" digital format on hard drives, or increasingly solid state drives, seems the safest option - but ensuring they are backed up in several places, and regularly checked for integrity. Let’s not even begin to consider which formats, standard today, might not even be readable in a few years.

I have an interest in audio recording, though my stuff has been much more recent and recorded digitally. I don’t know where to safely archive such files for posterity, so I upload them to my YouTube channel in the first instance. Who knows how long that site will continue, but it isn’t showing any signs of disappearing just yet.
Audacity (Free) would be the software to go for, to record and then save to a disk file. It's available for various platforms: Mac, Windows etc.
For some reason, you need to download "Muse Hub" first ( Ignore the "Cloud" web page that appears after clicking [Download] ), and then download Audacity from within that.
Files are saved after editing using "Export Audio" option. Original recording can be saved as a "Project", if you want to edit it later
A CD writer would be needed to transfer saved files to a CDR disk.
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
A lot of interesting stuff to get my teeth in to here before more photos follow.

I don't actually remember the noise of a K3, Larry @LarryG although I saw a few . Neither did I know there was a new build in the offing. Thanks, Nigel, for your additional info re the Class C lamps. It's great for me to see you potentially take advantage of the prototype inspiration. :)

Paul @hrmspaul - thanks indeed for the info on that wagon, and the edit following further input from Rob @Rob R .

Re Owen Glendower: Thanks Adam @AJC for all that detail. In fact my numbering of the loco was a typo - the original from which I took the detail is correct and I've now edited the info attached to the photo accordingly. Your information will go in to an attached file as will Barry's @Barry37 and Adam's @AJC . David @Genghis - yours will be added too.

Then we come to the sound recording debate. I agree very strongly with Tony's @76043 comments expanded by Simon @simond, Michael @Michael Hall , Bob @Bob Essex , Heather @Heather Kay (and you are so right about the preservation of all the formats - a real headache for video formats too where the oxide layer has a nasty habit of dropping off the substrate and stone age equipment has to be kept serviceable so that playback is possible. At least with Tim's images I can go back to the original film with a degree of confidence) and Barry @Barry37 for some really useful and practical thoughts.

Finally Martin @Martin Shaw - many thanks indeed for your details about that bracket signal.

Stratford Works Service Loco J66 No 32, the erstwhile 68370 with a couple more which remain unidentified in Stratford Works Service Loco Shed on 15th May 1960. The loco was already at Stratford in capital stock in January 1948 and was transferred to service stock when it was renumbered in September 1952. (BR Database). The loco was withdrawn and scrapped in 1962 (Wikipedia) probably at Stratford. See Locomotives Class J66

img3912 TM Neg Strip 19 Service loco 32 Stratford Shed dead 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

A string of locos here all dead on Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960. I’ll not list the history of each and I’m not even sure they are in the right order but Tim’s notes tell us that these are J69/1 68526, 68500 and 68609 the N7/5 69642 (although looking at this string I suspect it might be another J69, possibly 68642), N2 69575, J69/1 68552 and 68578, J50/1 68899, N7/5 69663, and Jinty 47306.

img3913 TM Neg Strip 19 68526, 68500, 68609 69642, 69575. 68552, 68578. 68899, 69663, 47306 St...jpg

J20/1 64685, Ivatt 4MT 43105, J15 65440, J20/1 64698 and J69/1 68613 but not in that order! These five are, however, a bit more manageable in terms of loco details than the string of ten above. All are dead on Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960. 64685 was last in post #4559. This was a Stratford engine from December 1945 and was withdrawn on 6th October 1960. (SLS). It was cut up at Stratford in November the same year. (Yeadons).

43105 was allocated to Stratford in March 1959 and was immediately in store but was allocated to March in July and Cambridge in August 1961. It went back to March in June and Lincoln in October 1962, New England in February and Carnforth in October 1964 where it was withdrawn in May 1967. (SLS). It was scrapped at Motherwell Machinery and Scrap, Wishaw (RO) in November 1967.

65440 was a Stratford loco from July 1951 (SLS), withdrawn in October 1960 (RO) and scrapped at Stratford (Yeadons Vol 35) in November the same year (BR Database).

Home for 64698 was Cambridge from November 1959 where it was withdrawn in March 1961. (SLS). It was reported by the SLS to be in Stratford Scrap Yard in the same month.

68613 had been a Stratford engine since at least 1948 (BR Database) and was withdrawn on 17th September 1961. (SLS). It was scrapped at Stratford (RO) during October the same year. (BR Database).

img3914 TM Neg Strip 19 64685, 43105, 65440, 64698, 68613 Stratford Shed dead 15 May 60 copyri...jpg

Brian
 

Michael Hall

Western Thunderer
Audacity (Free) would be the software to go for, to record and then save to a disk file. It's available for various platforms: Mac, Windows etc.
For some reason, you need to download "Muse Hub" first ( Ignore the "Cloud" web page that appears after clicking [Download] ), and then download Audacity from within that.
Files are saved after editing using "Export Audio" option. Original recording can be saved as a "Project", if you want to edit it later
A CD writer would be needed to transfer saved files to a CDR disk.
Thanks Barry37, I will investigate this process and see where it leads. My thanks to those who have responded and offered potential help and interest in this subject.
 

76043

Western Thunderer
As a museum professional grappling with digital preservation at work, my go to organisation is the DPC.


I've already done 20hrs of beginner training and hope to do more this year. It's a never ending process I'm afraid and is not an easy nut to conquer.

I would suggest that collaboration via line societies might be the best way forward for archiving, rather than trying to go it alone. The GERS for example works with the Essex Records Office.

Tony
 

Bob Essex

Western Thunderer
I think the subject of digital file storage is one fraught with difficulty in respect of the both the storage medium and the file format. All my wife and my files are stored across multiple hard drives, be it still image, music or video, all of which are capable of consuming large amounts of storage space. We do, as a matter of course, no longer used CD/DVD's because of their fragility over the longer term quite besides their limited actual storage space. After much consideration still image (which run into many tens of thousands) use plain Jpeg, music Mp3 and video Mp4 as these are we consider the most universal within each sphere and so most likely to survive longest. After we are gone how they are kept should it be desired will no longer be our concern because it's impossible to predict how the future will evolve.

Bob
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Thanks, all, for continuing the discussion about digital preservation. Strangely, in a move parallel to the music industry where vinyl is now more popular than CDs there is a move back to film. Through a process of colour separation even colour images can be stored on black and white film which, after scrupulous processing and washing can be regarded as archival. Many of the prestigious colour movies are stored in this format. However it's very expensive (although a small outlay in terms of a regular feature film budget) and 99.99% of people shooting digital images will keep them in one digital format or another. I'm personally caught in this at the moment. The vast majority of Tim's black and white images are in good order and show no deterioration. However, the colour slides which are from many and various sources, including but not exclusively Ferrania, Boots, Agfa, Kodachome, Kodak Ektachrome, Fuji and others show, with the exception of the Kodachrome slides which are, as a matter of interest basically a colour separation system, some deterioration of the dyes. I am therefore storing the digital scans in two formats, jpeg and TIFF because, as I understand it, TIFF is not a compressed file and will retain the corrected information. But I may be wrong...

However, this is a rabbit hole which I'm pleased to entertain on here if there are any further comments. Moving on to today's subjects, though:

J69/2 68513 home at Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960. The loco had been allocated to Stratford since at least January 1948 (BR Database) where it was withdrawn in October 1960. (SLS). It was scrapped at Stratford Works (Yeadons Vol 48) in June 1961. (BR Database).

img3915 TM Neg Strip 19 68513 Stratford Shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

By one of those quirks of fate here's an image of J68 68649 I took in October 1960 in exactly the same spot at Stratford. Tim and I were not to know one another for a further ten years. This loco had been at Stratford since March 1953 and was withdrawn in September 1961. It was scrapped in October the same year, probably at Stratford but confirmation will be appreciated.

68649.  Stratford.  October 1960.  copyright FINAL. Half pixel size image  Personal Collection...jpg

Yet another row of locos at Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960 comprising B1 61226, J69/1 68571 and N7/3 69681. 61226 was allocated to Parkeston Quay in December 1950, Stratford in February 1961 and was withdrawn in September 1962. (SLS). It was scrapped at Doncaster Works in November 1962. (BR Database).

68571 was a Stratford loco from November 1949 and was withdrawn in December 1960. (SLS). It was scrapped in June 1961 (BR Database) at Stratford. (RO).

69681 was another Stratford engine and had been there from at least January 1948 (BR Database) and was withdrawn in December 1960 being seen in Stratford Scrap Yard on 18th March 1961. (SLS).

img3916 TM Neg Strip 19 61226, 68571, 69681 Stratford Shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

A3 60062 Minoru on shed at Kings Cross on 15th May 1960. We've seen it previously at Kings Cross in February 1961 and Holloway Road in May 1963 and also in post #1999. It was a Kings Cross engine from October 1953 which went to New England in October 1961, Grantham in June and Doncaster in October before returning to New England in November 1963 from where it was withdrawn in December 1964. (SLS). The trough deflectors were fitted 5th June 1961. (SLS). It then went to King & Sons at Norwich where it was scrapped by the end of February 1965. (Rail UK).

img3917 TM Neg Strip 19 60062 Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyrght Final.jpg

A4 60002 Sir Murrough Wilson and A3 60042 Singapore carrying a 52A Gateshead shed plate with some of Tim’s friends (not me – as mentioned above I didn’t meet Tim for another ten years) at Kings Cross Shed on 15th May 1960. The A4 was a Gateshead engine from October 1943 (BR Database) and was withdrawn in May 1964. (SLS). It was scrapped in July the same year at Cohen’s, Cargo Fleet. (BR Database).

img3918 TM Neg Strip 19 60002 & 60042 with lads Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright F...jpg

Brian
 
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Eastsidepilot

Western Thunderer
A string of locos here all dead on Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960. I’ll not list the history of each and I’m not even sure they are in the right order but Tim’s notes tell us that these are J69/1 68526, 68500 and 68609 the N7/5 69642 (although looking at this string I suspect it might be another J69, possibly 68642), N2 69575, J69/1 68552 and 68578, J50/1 68899, N7/5 69663, and Jinty 47306.

View attachment 235947
The second J69 in the line up still has the GER pattern roof profile so was probably one of those sent to Scotland and later returned to Stratford.
 

Roger Pound

Western Thunderer
Another memory revived, thanks to Tim and yourself, Brian in #4,794. 60002 was the first A4 I ever saw. I was on my first ever train-spotting outing to Grantham and saw it as it departed north with a passenger working just as I approached the station. I can still hear the brieef chime from the whistle as it pulled away! I reckon it would have been in 1951 or thereabouts. It was the only occasion upon which I saw this A4, although I saw many others as the years went by. A3 60042 'Singapore' is also recorded as 'seen' in my old 1954 Ian Allan combined edition - the only remnaining record of my sightings in those days.
Thank you .

Roger.
 

Martin Shaw

Western Thunderer
Brian
Various bits and pieces
68370/ Dept 32 It was only ever allocated to Stratford Works. To traffic 6/86, Renumbered 27/9/52, Wdn 16/9/62, Cut up Stratford.

68526 Stratford 3/92, Boston 17/12/29, Grantham 14/12/23, Stratford 27/4/40, Parkeston 10/2/45, Stratford 8/3/47, Parkeston 1/11/59,
Stratford 24/1/60, Wdn 3/10/60, Cut up Stratford.

68500 Stratford 5/90, Eastfield 5/11/28, Thornton Junc 26/3/29, Carlisle Canal 5/5/41, Stratford 7/7/44, Parkeston 16/5/48, Stratford 23/7/50, Parkeston 8/4/51, Stratford 6/2/55, Parkeston 13/11/60, Starford 1/1/61, Wdn 13/1/61, Cut up Stratford.

68609 Cambridge 6/01, Bury St Edm 5/10/52, Cambridge 18/1/53, Stratford 1/11/59, Wdn 16/9/62, Cut up probably Stratford.

I would agree it isn't an N7 however 68642 was a J68 rather than a J69, it got around a bit which was usually the sign of a duff one so,

68642 Stratford 8/12, Kings X 4/9/24, Stratford 10/11/24, Norwich 9/4/34, Yarmouth 2/6/34, Norwich 17/5/36, Yarmouth 3/10/37,
Norwich 23/3/39, Yarmouth 17/5/39, Yarmouth Beach 17/12/39, Yarmouth 15/1/40, Norwich 19/5/40, Stratford 20/6/46, Parkeston 7/12/46, Stratford 18/1/48, Norwich 14/8/55, Lowestoft 17/8/58, Stratford 1/11/59, Wdn 10/9/61, Cut up Stratford.

An N2 at Stratford seems unlikely, this one was a Kings X engine at the time.

69575 Ardsley 20/11/28, Kings X 26/12/28, New England 10/9/61, Wdn 16/9/62, Cut up Doncaster 19/2/63.

68552 Stratford 6/94, Cambridge 31/1/25, Xfer to Scottish Area 1/11/27, Eastfield 16/11/27, Parkhead 26/10/32, Ferryhill 4/8/33, Eastfield 13/11/33, Kittybrewster 4/4/51, St Margarets 14/6/51, Stratford 17/2/52, Colwick 11/12/55, Colchester 18/3/56, Parkeston 1/11/59,
Stratford 28/2/60, Wdn 10/9/61, Cut up Stratford.

68578 Stratford 5/96. Colchester 4/12/49, Stratford 6/2/55, Parkeston 20/11/60, Stratford 1/1/61, Wdn 16/1/61, Cut up Stratford.

68899 Ardsley 4/14, Doncaster 6/2/40, Norwich 1/5/49, Stratford 3/4/60, Wdn 4/12/60, Cut up presumed Stratford. This was actually a J51.

69663 Ardsley 2/12/25, Stratford 18/12/25, Wdn 1/11/60, Cut up Stratford.

47306 Devons Rd 1/1/27, Rowsley 13/9/39, Nottingham 4/11/39, Devons Rd 9/12/39, Plaistow 3/3/51, Spital Bridge 31/12/55,
New England 20/4/57, Spital Bridge 10/8/57, Stratford 22/3/58, Lower Darwen 24/12/60, Bank Hall 4/2/61, Stored serviceable 19/3/62 - 9/3/63,
Gorton 9/11/63, Wdn w/e 19/12/64.

Col said and he was right.
The second J69 in the line up still has the GER pattern roof profile so was probably one of those sent to Scotland and later returned to Stratford.
 

Overseer

Western Thunderer
Thanks, all, for continuing the discussion about digital preservation. Strangely, in a move parallel to the music industry where vinyl is now more popular than CDs there is a move back to film. Through a process of colour separation even colour images can be stored on black and white film which, after scrupulous processing and washing can be regarded as archival. Many of the prestigious colour movies are stored in this format. However it's very expensive (although a small outlay in terms of a regular feature film budget) and 99.99% of people shooting digital images will keep them in one digital format or another. I'm personally caught in this at the moment. The vast majority of Tim's black and white images are in good order and show no deterioration. However, the colour slides which are from many and various sources, including but not exclusively Ferrania, Boots, Agfa, Kodachome, Kodak Ektachrome, Fuji and others show, with the exception of the Kodachrome slides which are, as a matter of interest basically a colour separation system, some deterioration of the dyes. I am therefore storing the digital scans in two formats, jpeg and TIFF because, as I understand it, TIFF is not a compressed file and will retain the corrected information. But I may be wrong...

However, this is a rabbit hole which I'm pleased to entertain on here if there are any further comments. Moving on to today's subjects, though:

J69/2 68513 home at Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960. The loco had been allocated to Stratford since at least January 1948 (BR Database) where it was withdrawn in October 1960. (SLS). It was scrapped at Stratford Works (Yeadons Vol 48) in June 1961. (BR Database).

View attachment 236096

By one of those quirks of fate here's an image of J68 68649 I took in October 1960 in exactly the same spot at Stratford. Tim and I were not to know one another for a further ten years. This loco had been at Stratford since March 1953 and was withdrawn in September 1961. It was scrapped in October the same year, probably at Stratford but confirmation will be appreciated.

View attachment 236100

Yet another row of locos at Stratford Shed on 15th May 1960 comprising B1 61226, J69/1 68571 and N7/3 69681. 61226 was allocated to Parkeston Quay in December 1950, Stratford in February 1961 and was withdrawn in September 1962. (SLS). It was scrapped at Doncaster Works in November 1962. (BR Database).

68571 was a Stratford loco from November 1949 and was withdrawn in December 1960. (SLS). It was scrapped in June 1961 (BR Database) at Stratford. (RO).

69681 was another Stratford engine and had been there from at least January 1948 (BR Database) and was withdrawn in December 1960 being seen in Stratford Scrap Yard on 18th March 1961. (SLS).

View attachment 236097

A3 60062 Minoru on shed at Kings Cross on 15th May 1960. We've seen it previously at Kings Cross in February 1961 and Holloway Road in May 1963 and also in post #1999. It was a Kings Cross engine from October 1953 which went to New England in October 1961, Grantham in June and Doncaster in October before returning to New England in November 1963 from where it was withdrawn in December 1964. (SLS). The trough deflectors were fitted 5th June 1961. (SLS). It then went to King & Sons at Norwich where it was scrapped by the end of February 1965. (Rail UK).

View attachment 236098

A4 60002 Sir Murrough Wilson and A3 60042 Singapore carrying a 52A Gateshead shed plate with some of Tim’s friends (not me – as mentioned above I didn’t meet Tim for another ten years) at Kings Cross Shed on 15th May 1960. The A4 was a Gateshead engine from October 1943 (BR Database) and was withdrawn in May 1964. (SLS). It was scrapped in July the same year at Cohen’s, Cargo Fleet. (BR Database).

View attachment 236099

Brian
While the locos might be the focus of attention it is the wagons which have caught my eye. While around 200,000 BR standard welded 16 ton steel mineral wagons were running by 1960 only one of the four steel mineral wagons visible (2 in Brian's photo and 2 in the last photo) is a BR diagram 1/108 wagon. The left hand welded steel mineral in Brian's photo has bottom doors and a pressed end door so probably ex LMS. The welded steel mineral in the last photo also has bottom doors and it looks like it has an E prefix number so ex LNER. The wagon partly visible beside the A4 is a slope sided wagon. They all look to be in good cosmetic condition. Just surprising, again, that the ratio of wagons in the photos is quite different to the ratios of wagons in service at the time.
 

oldravendale

Western Thunderer
Thanks for yours, Col @Eastsidepilot . I'd certainly never have known that detail so it's a good addition to the file. Also Roger @Roger Pound for what was clearly a special memory.

As ever, Martin, I'm grateful for the full details of those locos which will be added to the files. Do you have a record anywhere of the location where 68649 was scrapped? It'd be good to have full details for that photo.

You have expanded the information attached to those two photos, @Overseer. As you'll be aware my wagon knowledge is far from extensive so such information provides a useful source outside the locos themselves.

Celebrated B12 4-6-0 61572 surprisingly at Kings Cross on shed with a 32A Norwich shed plate next to B1 61075 on 15th May 1960. The B12 was allocated to Norwich Thorpe in October 1959 and was withdrawn in September 1961 (SLS) so I suspect was at Kings Cross either having worked or about to work a special. Details of the life thereafter are at

We saw 61075 at Holloway Road in April 1963 in post #1970. It was based at Kings Cross from June 1954 until October 1960 when it moved to New England and back to Kings Cross in June 1962 before landing up at Mexborough in June 1963. It was withdrawn in September the same year. (SLS). It then went to Hesslewood's at Atterclliffe where it was scrapped at the end of the year. (BR Database).

img3919 TM Neg Strip 19 61572 Kings Cross shed on shed 32A shed plate next to 61075 15 May 60 ...jpg

Three photos here of A4 60032 Gannet, and in the second one with 60015 Quicksilver at Kings Cross on shed 15th May 1960. Gannet was previously in posts #3012 and #4122. This had been a Kings Cross engine since June 1950 and went to New England in June 1963 from where it was withdrawn in October the same year. (SLS). It then went to Doncaster where it was scrapped in December. (BR Database).

Quicksilver has been seen in posts #2024 and #3572. It was a Kings Cross engine from 1951 and was withdrawn from there towards the end of April 1963. (SLS). It went to Doncaster Works for disposal which was complete by the middle of May. (BR Database).

img3920 TM Neg Strip 19 60032 Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

img3921 TM Neg Strip 19 60032, 60015 Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

img3922 TM Neg Strip 19 60032 Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

A1 60154 Bon Accord, previously in post #2423 is here on Kings Cross Shed on 15th May 1960. It was a Gateshead engine from September 1949, moving to York North in November 1960 and Neville Hill in August 1963 where it was withdrawn in October 1965. (SLS). It was sold to T W Ward Beighton for scrap in November. (BR Database).

img3923 TM Neg Strip 19 60154 Kings Cross shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

Fowler 3P 2-6-2T 40066 at Willesden shed on 15th May 1960. This had been a Willesden engine since September 1952, went in to store in May 1959 and was withdrawn in the following November so was already withdrawn at the time of the photo. (SLS). Disposal was at Stratford Works in June 1960. (BR Database).

img3924 TM Neg Strip 19 40066 Willesden shed on shed 15 May 60 copyright Final.jpg

Brian
 
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