AJC
Western Thunderer
Plymouth North Road and Exeter St David’s seemed to manage with up and down in both directions - indeed, the latter still does!
Adam
Prototype Tim Mills' Photos
- Thread starter oldravendale
- Start date
Plymouth North Road and Exeter St David’s seemed to manage with up and down in both directions - indeed, the latter still does!
Adam
Arun Sharma
Western Thunderer
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
I'm back from my brief sojourn in the Lake District (and very lovely it was too). Having caught up with emails and other messages, garden etc I'm now able to concentrate on the important stuff - ie WT! Please forgive me for not thanking individually all the contributors to the information about the photo of 48063. However the key was Dave @Genghis and then Dave @Yorkshire Dave who has nailed the location. The photo was probably taken on the occasion when 7029 was recorded at Coton Hill in March 1967 as seen in post #5657 and in post #5694 when there's an unidentified Black 5.
An unidentified Black 5 or 8F on freight. I believe this to be the Ribblehead Viaduct on the Settle & Carlisle. Once again it’s dated to the mid 1960s. Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave.
Black 5 44878, possibly on Shap or could be the S & C. Another in the mid 1960s. The SLS give only one allocation for the loco and that’s Lostock Hall from December 1967/January 1968 where it was withdrawn in June/July 1968. However going back through Locoshed Books it’s shown as allocated to Carlisle Kingmoor from at least April 1957 to May 1964 and BR Database have a “snapshot” allocation of Carlisle Kingmoor on 1st January 1948. After withdrawal from Lostock Hall it went to Cohen’s, Kettering (BR Database) where it was photographed being cut up on 1st March 1969 (WHTS). BR Database proposes a scrapping month of February 1968 and that’s close enough for Government work. Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave
Jubilee 45593 Kolhapur on the Thames-Clyde Express and believed to be at Ribblehead on the Settle and Carlisle. Again this is the mid 1960s. In November/December 1963 it was allocated to Burton, Patricroft in September/October 1964, Newton Heath in December 1964/January 1965 and Holbeck in April 1965 where it was withdrawn on 15th October 1967. (SLS). For some strange reason BR Database report a scrapping month of August 1963! However, on 9th September 1967 the SLS reported the loco as “still active”. Further information about the loco in preservation can be found here:
45593 Kolhapur (LMS 5593 & BR 45593) Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave
Brian
An unidentified Black 5 or 8F on freight. I believe this to be the Ribblehead Viaduct on the Settle & Carlisle. Once again it’s dated to the mid 1960s. Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave.
Black 5 44878, possibly on Shap or could be the S & C. Another in the mid 1960s. The SLS give only one allocation for the loco and that’s Lostock Hall from December 1967/January 1968 where it was withdrawn in June/July 1968. However going back through Locoshed Books it’s shown as allocated to Carlisle Kingmoor from at least April 1957 to May 1964 and BR Database have a “snapshot” allocation of Carlisle Kingmoor on 1st January 1948. After withdrawal from Lostock Hall it went to Cohen’s, Kettering (BR Database) where it was photographed being cut up on 1st March 1969 (WHTS). BR Database proposes a scrapping month of February 1968 and that’s close enough for Government work. Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave
Jubilee 45593 Kolhapur on the Thames-Clyde Express and believed to be at Ribblehead on the Settle and Carlisle. Again this is the mid 1960s. In November/December 1963 it was allocated to Burton, Patricroft in September/October 1964, Newton Heath in December 1964/January 1965 and Holbeck in April 1965 where it was withdrawn on 15th October 1967. (SLS). For some strange reason BR Database report a scrapping month of August 1963! However, on 9th September 1967 the SLS reported the loco as “still active”. Further information about the loco in preservation can be found here:
45593 Kolhapur (LMS 5593 & BR 45593) Edit: Confirmed as Ribblehead by @Yorkshire Dave
Brian
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Yorkshire Dave
Western Thunderer
All three are taken at Ribblehead.
img615. 44878. Possibly Shap. Mid 1960s. copyright FINAL - Copy.jpg
A rather nice very mixed parcels train with LMS 4 wheel CCT followed by SR BY - which had guard and brakes so no need for the brake van followed by a couple of the later LMS plywood sided vans and a BR GUV, BR CCT (I think) and BR GUV. My computer screen doesn't permit more detail of the following 5 vans and then what just might be a BR(ER) BZ (as recently RTR modelled by TMC). But a bit of a wild guess.Paul
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
Thanks
There appear to be three BR standard vans (although could be GWR, it was the ends which were significantly different one to another. Then an LMS van and a SR van - looks like the roof profile is curving over the side. And yes, that does look like a BZ, although whether the ones with a square end to the top light or curved I couldn't guess
I found it strange how little interest was taken in parcels stock back in the 50s and 60s. Even after the main wagon books of the later 1970s it was difficult to find out much about them, even the main number blocks. They were so varied, and some published schedules of trains showed incredible attaching and detaching of vans as a train progressed through the night going up/down the likes of the WCML. The most incredibly complex operation and now all gone. And of course that was one reason why it is possible to get ER, LMR, and SR stock all within a few vans of one another. Great for modellers, especially if the pre-Xmas traffic is being modelled when previously stored locos could get their last outings, as well as some ancient rolling stock - not least passenger carriages (the multi door ones) loaded with mail bags.
I expect someone else could tell us what the maximum speed of the 4 wheel vans was, and therefore what restriction there was on trains made up such as this.
The very best book for illustrating the range of stock is
Paul
oldravendale
Western Thunderer
Once again thank you Paul @hrmspaul for all the information about those vehicles, and for your comments. I was one of those taking photos of trains in the same period as Tim and to my everlasting regret never photographed wagons or coaches.
Class Q6 0-8-0 63435 carrying a 51C, West Hartlepool shed plate. This is at Darlington probably in March or April 1965. At the time the loco allocation is confirmed as West Hartlepool by the SLS who also show a withdrawal date of 5th June 1966. The loco was sold for scrap to Hughes Bolckow at Blyth in July 1966.
Class J21 0-6-0 65033 at Darlington in March 1965. It was seen in the yard in September 1964. I personally saw and photographed it at Darlington in October 1964 with partially stripped 65099 which appeared to be donating parts and 65033 (NER 876, LNER 5033 & BR 65033) describes that the boiler from 65099 was transferred to 65033. In this photo it may well be 65099 behind tender to tender. 65033/99 were recorded in Darlington Works Yard from at least January 1964 to September 1964 (SLS) and Tim’s photo suggests even longer than that. 65099 was scrapped at Darlington in February 1966 (SLS and BR Database) having been withdrawn on 30th October 1961 from Tyne Dock, it’s final allocation from December 1958.
65033 was allocated to Blyth (North) in April/May 1960, Heaton in January 1961 and back to Blyth North in April the same year where it was withdrawn on 23rd April 1962. (Info combined from SLS and BR Database).
Probably at Darlington in April 1965 although possibly at its home shed, West Hartlepool was Q6 63391. It was allocated to West Hartlepool from May/June 1958 and withdrawn from there on 12th April 1965 (SLS). According to BR Database it went in to Darlington on 12th April 1965 for cutting up but was sold for scrap to G Cohen, Cargo Fleet on 3rd June 1965.
Brian
Class Q6 0-8-0 63435 carrying a 51C, West Hartlepool shed plate. This is at Darlington probably in March or April 1965. At the time the loco allocation is confirmed as West Hartlepool by the SLS who also show a withdrawal date of 5th June 1966. The loco was sold for scrap to Hughes Bolckow at Blyth in July 1966.
Class J21 0-6-0 65033 at Darlington in March 1965. It was seen in the yard in September 1964. I personally saw and photographed it at Darlington in October 1964 with partially stripped 65099 which appeared to be donating parts and 65033 (NER 876, LNER 5033 & BR 65033) describes that the boiler from 65099 was transferred to 65033. In this photo it may well be 65099 behind tender to tender. 65033/99 were recorded in Darlington Works Yard from at least January 1964 to September 1964 (SLS) and Tim’s photo suggests even longer than that. 65099 was scrapped at Darlington in February 1966 (SLS and BR Database) having been withdrawn on 30th October 1961 from Tyne Dock, it’s final allocation from December 1958.
65033 was allocated to Blyth (North) in April/May 1960, Heaton in January 1961 and back to Blyth North in April the same year where it was withdrawn on 23rd April 1962. (Info combined from SLS and BR Database).
Probably at Darlington in April 1965 although possibly at its home shed, West Hartlepool was Q6 63391. It was allocated to West Hartlepool from May/June 1958 and withdrawn from there on 12th April 1965 (SLS). According to BR Database it went in to Darlington on 12th April 1965 for cutting up but was sold for scrap to G Cohen, Cargo Fleet on 3rd June 1965.
Brian
GreenAyre42
Member
Just to add to Yorkshire Dave's notes on 5923 re Ribblehead Viaduct, trains 1 & 3 are traveling north bound. Not sure about train 2.
Yorkshire Dave
Western Thunderer
Photo 2 is also travelling north. The photo was taken from a position to the right of photo 1 as you can see the continuation of the drystone wall following the base of the embankment. Both 1 and 2 are at the Ribblehead Station (south) end of the viaduct. Photo 3 was taken at the north end looking south with Park Fell and Simon Fell in the background. Ingleborough Hill (also the site of an Iron Age Hill fort) is out of frame on the right.
We all know it as Ribblehead Viaduct but on OS maps it's referred to as Batty Moss Viaduct as it's crossing Batty Moss.