Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
I need a source of Sun/Mirror/Mail/Express front pages from the early 1980s.
Actually, since Richard asks that no humans appear in his coaches, any signs of life would be beyond the brief.
7mm On Heather's workbench - a trio of JLTRT Mk2s
- Thread starter Heather Kay
- Start date
I need a source of Sun/Mirror/Mail/Express front pages from the early 1980s.
Actually, since Richard asks that no humans appear in his coaches, any signs of life would be beyond the brief.
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
And what is the debris on top of the sand in the bucket? Looks like detritus from Fag-End-Lil.... since Richard asks that no humans appear in his coaches, any signs of life would be beyond the brief.
BTW, like the TCCs... how did you make them?
regards, Graham
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
It's just sand. The bucket is moulded with lumpy contents in situ.
The TCCs are small blocks of Evergreen strip for the wooden bracket, short lengths of suitable brass etch from the Bits Box, bent over in a J-shape at one end, and a roughly 5ft length of tinned copper wire joining the clips together. It was all superglued together, and then the wire carelessly twisted like the prototype images from earlier in the thread.
Kept me quiet for half an hour or so.
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
What about this?
BrushType4
Western Thunderer
Or these
john lewsey
Western Thunderer
Looks good Heather
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
This thread has just started over there...
http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/in...2-air-conditioned-coaches-detail-differences/
http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/in...2-air-conditioned-coaches-detail-differences/
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
Interesting. I do wonder, though, why bother with all that detail for N gauge... *shrug*
Bob Reid
Western Thunderer
Much as I like to contribute what I can "over there" as well - I get a bit annoyed at the open "tell me all what I need to know" type questions - much better over here - you can see the benefit of folk's rather more targetted/specific questions. Like why did Heather leave off the rings for tethering your dog on the van side of the partition?
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
While I'm loving this discussion, I'd like to discreetly draw a veil over further detailing options. I'm already going over and beyond the scope (and budget) of the original brief. 
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
While the weather refuses to let me dunk the errant side, I've been completing the underframes. By this I mean fitting the bufferbeam dangly bits and painting everything in sight.
Here's the bag-full of brass castings. Mostly, they're pretty clean, minimal flash or mould lines to clean up.
Having extricated the buckeye parts, this is what's left. From the top left, clockwise: Buffers, extended; buffers, retracted; ETH connectors; corner steps; gangway supports; commode and door handles; buffer stocks; air brake and control pipes.
The commode handles are a slightly untidy casting, but as there are only four handles per coach it's fairly easy to pick out the cleanest ones.
As I'm building two SOs and a BSO, Richard asked that the brake end of the latter has the dropped buckeye coupling. This means the buffers are in extended form. You'll note the extended buffers include a representation of the collar - more on that shortly - and the stocks include the collar bracket (missing from the Mk1 castings, incidentally).
Here's the brake end from underneath. As the other end, and other coaches are all using the Kadee couplings, this is the only end that uses the supplied cast knuckle and buffer springing. I do realise the steam heating pipe ought to be fitted into the buffer beam, but I didn't have enough suitable castings in the bits box. As related earlier, this casting just happened to have three pairs.
The buffer springing system is neat. A moulded slot is designed to hold a length of brass, nickel or steel wire, which passes through a hole in the buffer shank. I couldn't find wire that I deemed soft enough that didn't bend under pressure, so while the buffers do push in and return it won't be under normal buffering up on a layout.
I have left all the corner steps until the models are nearly complete. The reason for this is they are very fragile castings, easily bent by the slightest knock.
Here are the dangly bits on the brake end. Once the gangway is installed, it should look suitably cluttered and mucky.
When the buffers are extended in order that a non-buckeye coupled vehicle, or loco, can be attached, there is a steel half-collar dropped over the shank to prevent the buffer pushing too far back. The non-retracted buffer castings includes a representation of the collar (again, not in the Mk1 kit - I may suggest to the inestimable Laurie they consider including the Mk2 parts in the Mk1 kits). Obviously, with the collar in use, the bracket on the stock would be empty. I filed away the moulded collar detail to leave the bracket. The idea of adding the retaining chain crossed my mind, fleetingly, and was dismissed as beyond the realms of budget. If someone requested such a detail - as well as the retaining chains on the pipework - I'd put it in. In fact, if I were to build a complete rake of coaches I'd very likely build them so the connections were all connected properly, rather in the manner of a Bill Bedford coupling in 4mm scale.
Bogie step detailing today, I think.
Here's the bag-full of brass castings. Mostly, they're pretty clean, minimal flash or mould lines to clean up.
Having extricated the buckeye parts, this is what's left. From the top left, clockwise: Buffers, extended; buffers, retracted; ETH connectors; corner steps; gangway supports; commode and door handles; buffer stocks; air brake and control pipes.
The commode handles are a slightly untidy casting, but as there are only four handles per coach it's fairly easy to pick out the cleanest ones.
As I'm building two SOs and a BSO, Richard asked that the brake end of the latter has the dropped buckeye coupling. This means the buffers are in extended form. You'll note the extended buffers include a representation of the collar - more on that shortly - and the stocks include the collar bracket (missing from the Mk1 castings, incidentally).
Here's the brake end from underneath. As the other end, and other coaches are all using the Kadee couplings, this is the only end that uses the supplied cast knuckle and buffer springing. I do realise the steam heating pipe ought to be fitted into the buffer beam, but I didn't have enough suitable castings in the bits box. As related earlier, this casting just happened to have three pairs.
The buffer springing system is neat. A moulded slot is designed to hold a length of brass, nickel or steel wire, which passes through a hole in the buffer shank. I couldn't find wire that I deemed soft enough that didn't bend under pressure, so while the buffers do push in and return it won't be under normal buffering up on a layout.
I have left all the corner steps until the models are nearly complete. The reason for this is they are very fragile castings, easily bent by the slightest knock.
Here are the dangly bits on the brake end. Once the gangway is installed, it should look suitably cluttered and mucky.
When the buffers are extended in order that a non-buckeye coupled vehicle, or loco, can be attached, there is a steel half-collar dropped over the shank to prevent the buffer pushing too far back. The non-retracted buffer castings includes a representation of the collar (again, not in the Mk1 kit - I may suggest to the inestimable Laurie they consider including the Mk2 parts in the Mk1 kits). Obviously, with the collar in use, the bracket on the stock would be empty. I filed away the moulded collar detail to leave the bracket. The idea of adding the retaining chain crossed my mind, fleetingly, and was dismissed as beyond the realms of budget. If someone requested such a detail - as well as the retaining chains on the pipework - I'd put it in. In fact, if I were to build a complete rake of coaches I'd very likely build them so the connections were all connected properly, rather in the manner of a Bill Bedford coupling in 4mm scale.
Bogie step detailing today, I think.
Steph Dale
Western Thunderer
Blimey, that NQLTRT drop-head buckeye is so ugly!
I had a set for a brief while until I realised they wouldn't fit my (Southern) stock. In end I used S-scale Kadees that were modified to drop-head. One problem with Southern carriage stock is the lack of height between the end beam of the bogie and the bottom of the gangway, so the 0-gauge #805 coupler won't fit. Actually the 0-gauge coupler is about same degree of oversize as the S-scale one is undersize!
It's nice to see that the buffers are in some way retractable, the only other place I've come across that before is with Slaters' Maunsell carriages, where they operate prototypically with removable shoes. And yes, they come with chains for the shoes and work very well.
Steph
I had a set for a brief while until I realised they wouldn't fit my (Southern) stock. In end I used S-scale Kadees that were modified to drop-head. One problem with Southern carriage stock is the lack of height between the end beam of the bogie and the bottom of the gangway, so the 0-gauge #805 coupler won't fit. Actually the 0-gauge coupler is about same degree of oversize as the S-scale one is undersize!
It's nice to see that the buffers are in some way retractable, the only other place I've come across that before is with Slaters' Maunsell carriages, where they operate prototypically with removable shoes. And yes, they come with chains for the shoes and work very well.
Steph
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
I know what you mean, Steph, though I think the buckeye makes into a fair representation of the real thing. It certainly looks the part in the gloom under the gangway.
Bogie steps. I've decided to take the easy route, and await some nice etches ones from Middlesex. Incidentally, Tom sent me off to a web site chock full of lovely photographs of all kinds of Mk2 coaches. The rotter. Now I am painfully aware of all kinds of details I either need to add, or pretend I didn't see.
In my ignorance, I was completely oblivious to the Mk2C brake coach roof being entirely different to the Mk2B roof - since there was never a 2B brake, I blithely accepted what JLTRT put in the box. More fool me. I should have twigged, because at least the vent pattern ought to have been different, never mind the access panel over the toilet. At this late stage, while I could convert the thing to be more accurate, I shall have to consult with the man who is paying for this malarkey. I think I know what he'll say, too.
Meanwhile, I have turned my attention to the remaining underpart details on the BSO, in this case the access steps for the guard.
Rather belatedly I realised the cast whitemetal step on the guard's compartment side was miscast.
There ought to be a leg on the left the same length as that on the right. I scratched my noddle for a about thirty seconds, rummaged in my bits box, and about an hour later had created from brass angle, scrap etch and some PCB, the confection on the left.
It'll still be fragile, but with the brass wire pegs will at least have a chance of hanging on during handling.
The step the other side is supposed to just glue straight to the battery box. Right. Good mechanical fixing there. Not a chance that'll ping off the first time the coach is picked up awkwardly. I drilled the casting for wire pegs, and drilled the battery box to receive them. It should survive all but the most ham-fisted.
It rather looks like the weather will turn a little milder, so I hope tomorrow will see paint being removed. Then I can get back to being messy with the airbrush, and perhaps get to a point where I can put the component parts together and make a complete coach at last!
Bogie steps. I've decided to take the easy route, and await some nice etches ones from Middlesex.
Incidentally, Tom sent me off to a web site chock full of lovely photographs of all kinds of Mk2 coaches. The rotter. Now I am painfully aware of all kinds of details I either need to add, or pretend I didn't see. In my ignorance, I was completely oblivious to the Mk2C brake coach roof being entirely different to the Mk2B roof - since there was never a 2B brake, I blithely accepted what JLTRT put in the box. More fool me. I should have twigged, because at least the vent pattern ought to have been different, never mind the access panel over the toilet. At this late stage, while I could convert the thing to be more accurate, I shall have to consult with the man who is paying for this malarkey. I think I know what he'll say, too.
Meanwhile, I have turned my attention to the remaining underpart details on the BSO, in this case the access steps for the guard.
Rather belatedly I realised the cast whitemetal step on the guard's compartment side was miscast.
There ought to be a leg on the left the same length as that on the right. I scratched my noddle for a about thirty seconds, rummaged in my bits box, and about an hour later had created from brass angle, scrap etch and some PCB, the confection on the left.
It'll still be fragile, but with the brass wire pegs will at least have a chance of hanging on during handling.
The step the other side is supposed to just glue straight to the battery box. Right. Good mechanical fixing there. Not a chance that'll ping off the first time the coach is picked up awkwardly. I drilled the casting for wire pegs, and drilled the battery box to receive them. It should survive all but the most ham-fisted.
It rather looks like the weather will turn a little milder, so I hope tomorrow will see paint being removed. Then I can get back to being messy with the airbrush, and perhaps get to a point where I can put the component parts together and make a complete coach at last!
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
I wonder what the C&W maintenance gang thought of that arrangement when time came to change a battery or two.
regards, Graham
Dog Star
Western Thunderer
Web site? where please.
Please do not keep us in the dark... what differences? why would the vent pattern be different?
You can try to persuade Laurie to provide another (different) roof plus vents on the basis that the materials provided were defective... defective design that is.
regards, Graham
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
The site in question is http://80srail.zenfolio.com
The differences are plain when you see them.
A Mk2B SO: http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/h198148d0#h75513e5
A Mk2C BSO: http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/h1782136a#h1782136a
Note the BSO has an access panel in the roof above the toilet, and the ventilators are flat plate-like structures, three placed on the roof centreline. (I now think JLTRT made and packed the wrong roof - it should have been the same roof as for the D/E/F kits they make.)
The detail, which to be honest is easy to add, to the SOs is the toilet tank overflow pipe. I'd never noticed it before, but you can see the little stovepipe structure plainly in the SO shot, highlighted by the water that's overflowed! Oh, and I don't need the toilet window ventilators on the BSO. Glad I spotted that one.
This carriage picking game is hard work, you know. Give me a nice straightforward locomotive next time!
The differences are plain when you see them.
A Mk2B SO: http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/h198148d0#h75513e5
A Mk2C BSO: http://80srail.zenfolio.com/p46631637/h1782136a#h1782136a
Note the BSO has an access panel in the roof above the toilet, and the ventilators are flat plate-like structures, three placed on the roof centreline. (I now think JLTRT made and packed the wrong roof - it should have been the same roof as for the D/E/F kits they make.)
The detail, which to be honest is easy to add, to the SOs is the toilet tank overflow pipe. I'd never noticed it before, but you can see the little stovepipe structure plainly in the SO shot, highlighted by the water that's overflowed! Oh, and I don't need the toilet window ventilators on the BSO. Glad I spotted that one.
This carriage picking game is hard work, you know. Give me a nice straightforward locomotive next time!
tomstaf
Western Thunderer
Heather,
I had a strange discussion with Laurie a few years ago about the roof vents on MK2s. He didn't seem convinced air con MK2s or the Cs had them. They're made by roe-vac. But unfortunately JLTRT have never addressed that deficiency and I don't think they have any plans to either.
It's on my plan to 3D print them but I'm finding them hard to draw up. So they're on the slow cooker for now.
Cheers
Tom
PS - during that measuring expedition I suddenly realised why some like to 'train surf'
Heather Kay
Western Thunderer
PS - during that measuring expedition I suddenly realised why some like to 'train surf'
The mind boggles!
I've been in touch with Richard, and I'm going to order a 2F roof from Laurie to be collected at Kettering this Saturday and sent on to me. I think that's the best way forward, though I wasn't against scratch-building if needed. Some plastic sheet and a triplet of carved plastic lumps would do.
As an aside, Laurie has asked me to build a Mk2 SO for the JLTRT exhibition stand. It seems no-one managed to get round to one before! Aside from the livery, which I'm secretly hoping might not be blue/grey, it's going to be literally straight out of the box with no Kavanagh extras allowed. I plan to deliver it to the JLTRT stand at the ALSRM Reading show, and it may transpire Richard's coaches will be delivered at the same place. If any of you manage to make the show, you may see the fruits of our combined efforts in the flesh.
Things may get a little quiet over the next few days. I have a collection of sub-assemblies now, with only painting (and one roof!) delaying things. I have to fit the end grab handles, but that's about it.
While I think of it, anyone know how long the ETH connector cable is?
tomstaf
Western Thunderer
The mind boggles!
While I think of it, anyone know how long the ETH connector cable is?
All sounds very good Heather. Anglia livery is a nice one
I don't know how long the cables are but I can give you their thickness:
Cheers
Tom