4mm Polsarrett: BR(S) N Cornwall Clay, The Final Countdown

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Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Really pleased how it all turned out in the end. A lot of work for just 6hrs of show but hopefully it will be out again at some point. There's interest to take it along to Cardiff and Stafford shows, so we'll see.

Regarding the track plan, you never quite know how things are going to turn out but again I'm pleased to say there's enough play value to lose track of time shunting wagons around.

One thing that stunned me was that we had the layout taken down and packed into the car by 16.12. The layout was engineered learning lessons from other layouts to have no time consuming bolts or screws to faff around with but even so the lack of time taken to pack up felt completely alien.

I'm really glad that in the end I went for the fiddles each being 900mm X 500mm. It looked overkill at home and my original plan was for something more compact. The space was however fully used and there was even room for tea and cake, plus a dodgy GWR railmotor that resided on the layout all day (Kernow EP).

Improvements for the next show? I'm going to have a rethink on a section location at the far right end of the layout but apart from that operationally it all seemed to work. The main effort will go into finishing off all the part complete scenic elements and adding detail, just not just yet!

I was disappointed with the lighting though. The light itself is fine and very controllable - both temperature and amount. The disappointing element was the amount of banding coming through on photos and video.

I understand that this is to do with the refresh rates of the LEDs marching the scan rate of the camera but it was very noticeable on the Facebook live event video that it really affected my layout not others. I can change the 'shutter speed on my phone camera to combat this but others can't and the resultant banding really spoils photos.

Is the action to change the power supply or the LEDs or both? Is it more pronounced on my layout as I've used bi-colour (warm and cool) LED tape? It really seems to be pot luck. Any advice woul be appreciated.

In summary though I'm completely sold now on small self contained layouts that fit in the back of a car. No van hire. Quick to erect and dismantle. Usable at home. What's not to love? I was however surprised at how much construction time the layout ate up.
 
simond

simond

Western Thunderer
Pencarrow said:
Is the action to change the power supply or the LEDs or both?
Click to expand...

hypothesis; the leds are just leds - no point in changing them.

The power supplies control them by flashing them on and off very quickly, the proportion of “on” vs “off” defines the apparent brightness. As you note, the frequency of switching may well cause the banding if it is close to the scan frequency of the camera. You could check by putting the lights on 100% and seeing if the banding is still obvious, as I’d guess they shouldn’t be turning off at all, so no banding.

What to do? Probably replace the power supplies/controllers. If you can get higher frequency ones, that should sort the problem out.
 
Mark F

Mark F

Western Thunderer
Pencarrow said:
Really pleased how it all turned out in the end. A lot of work for just 6hrs of show but hopefully it will be out again at some point. There's interest to take it along to Cardiff and Stafford shows, so we'll see.

Regarding the track plan, you never quite know how things are going to turn out but again I'm pleased to say there's enough play value to lose track of time shunting wagons around.

One thing that stunned me was that we had the layout taken down and packed into the car by 16.12. The layout was engineered learning lessons from other layouts to have no time consuming bolts or screws to faff around with but even so the lack of time taken to pack up felt completely alien.

I'm really glad that in the end I went for the fiddles each being 900mm X 500mm. It looked overkill at home and my original plan was for something more compact. The space was however fully used and there was even room for tea and cake, plus a dodgy GWR railmotor that resided on the layout all day (Kernow EP).

Improvements for the next show? I'm going to have a rethink on a section location at the far right end of the layout but apart from that operationally it all seemed to work. The main effort will go into finishing off all the part complete scenic elements and adding detail, just not just yet!

I was disappointed with the lighting though. The light itself is fine and very controllable - both temperature and amount. The disappointing element was the amount of banding coming through on photos and video.

I understand that this is to do with the refresh rates of the LEDs marching the scan rate of the camera but it was very noticeable on the Facebook live event video that it really affected my layout not others. I can change the 'shutter speed on my phone camera to combat this but others can't and the resultant banding really spoils photos.

Is the action to change the power supply or the LEDs or both? Is it more pronounced on my layout as I've used bi-colour (warm and cool) LED tape? It really seems to be pot luck. Any advice woul be appreciated.

In summary though I'm completely sold now on small self contained layouts that fit in the back of a car. No van hire. Quick to erect and dismantle. Usable at home. What's not to love? I was however surprised at how much construction time the layout ate up.
Click to expand...
Just adding my thoughts after spending a bit of time operating the layout on Sunday.

In a relatively small space you've built something that looks great (and realistic) and is fun to operate - something which I find can be quite a challenge to balance.

Everything worked as expected. I experienced no issues with the servos and with exception of possibly wanting an isolating section at the platform reverting to using DC (after 15 years of only using DCC) didn't cause me any issues. Unless you are considering fitting sound I see no advantage of DCC here - the all locos ran smoothly and reliably on DC.

It took me a while to get my head around the layout of the control panel; for me a more schematic layout might have worked better - but that was largely down to me being unfamiliar with it. I did find myself forgetting to throw the switch for the first point a few times, I think because it's hidden behind the cottage I simply forgot it was there! User error rather than any fault of the layout.

The banding caused by the lighting is something I see under the LED lighting on my workbench. Although visible through my phone screen it's never caused an issue taking photos. I assume that's because there is sufficient light to make the shutter speed faster than the refresh rate. Video might be a different matter. I don't recall it being and issue with the lighting on Fryers though - I'll see if I can find the power supply and and technical spec for them. I suppose the other difference between Fryers and Polsarrett would be that you've included a ceiling above the layout, which was something I had intended to do but never got around to. Could it be that the ambient lighting balances out the LED refreshes on Fryers. Worth a try without the lid on?

As you say, loading, set up and break down were quick and easy. From my experience the key is to reduce the number of trips to the car needed to load/unloading. To that end the only suggestion I would make would be could you use the fiddle yards joined face to face to form a carry case for the cassettes and maybe a few other small items? Maybe over centre catches to create a sort of packing case.

Obviously it could do with more diesels, but overall a fantastic achievement and a fun little layout to operate, I look forward to playing trains again some time.
 
Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Cheers Mark, really good to have your comments - it's partly your fault I built Polsarrett after enjoyable trips out with Fryers Lane.

It's always the worry on a first outing that you've ended up making something that either doesn't actually work or has unforeseen problems built into it which become a pain for operation. It was a big relief that the layout was fun to shunt whilst also be a bit challenging too, and I think the backwards siding into the goods yard helps here.

I did have a play in one of my operating sessions with running the layout as a terminus and ignoring the right hand fiddle. That was interesting too and the layout when hung on the train room wall will probably run in that manner as there's not really room for both fiddles.

Things to change following the show...
  1. The control panel definitely. The original idea was that it would be built and installed on the layout inside the LSWR cottage and hence it is overly compact. That didn't really work well as it was visible behind the roof cutout and the idea got binned. The panel moved onto the fiddle and hence can be bigger and better laid out. I acquired 6 DC Concepts point levers from the BGman sales, so they will be used....
  2. I'm going to have a think about the location of the isolating section by the platform and agree it's not quite right yet. Wasn't a major issue, more of a tweak.
  3. Stock boxes. It took more time to put the stock away than dismantle and load the layout. I'll be knocking something up that I can just drop the stock (carefully) into.
  4. Although the servos worked all day during the show, I'm still not confident that they won't let me down at some point. As a starting tweak I will be amending the mechanical actuation under the layout and have the bits for that. I haven't yet decided if I'll stick with servos or change the whole lot over to Tortoise point motors.
  5. Scenics will need to be completed. It wasn't obvious in Jamie's excellent photos but there was quite a lot still part done or bodged for the show. There's a few buildings that need to be finished before they are fixed to the board. There also needs to be a few people on the layout, not many but just enough to take away the ghost town look.
  6. Stock. Mark is heroically finishing of the clay wagon fleet and I need to sort out the locos. Properly detail and weather them plus fit crew.
  7. Couplings. The Kadees were an interim solution but I'll eventually use something else. The Kadees worked ok after a lot of tweaking prior to the show but do prevent fitting buffer beam detail. Another point to consider is that Mark hates them ;-p The candidates are probably DG or S&W.
  8. As Mark mentioned, some neatening up of how loose stuff packs away would be good too.
  9. Ban diesels...
Apart from that the layout is finished!
 
Phil O

Phil O

Western Thunderer
For the stock box, how about a tray like box that you can put the cassettes in complete with stock and add strips of foam to hold the stock in position, no stock handling required, oh and a hinged lid.
 
Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Having said that I wasn't going to do anything on the layout for a while... Yesterday I got the drill and hammer out and, after a trip to the DIY emporium, fixed some twin slot shelving rails to the wall.

IMG_20220430_175903.jpg

The original idea was to use just one of the layout's fiddles (the left one) to enable the layout to be used in end-to-end form at home. In that guise it looks like this:

IMG_20220430_182127.jpg

The wall rail for the brackets will enable me to alter the height of the layout. It is currently at its show height. In putting the layout up I did discover that the fiddles were longer that I thought - 3'2" rather than 3'.

I'm now thinking that I'm going to make some reduced length and slimline fiddles. This should enable the layout to be shifted 8"+ to the left and provide better access to the bookcase and the 7mm layout Pencarrow.
 
Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Having thought long and hard, I've declined exhibition invites for Polsarrett for the remainder of 2022. Focus for quite a while will be on domestic matters, there's an embarrassingly long list of stuff wot needs dun.

That's the long way around to saying - don't expect updates on Polsarrett or Pencarrow anytime soon.

But don't worry, abnormal service will resume after sorting out stuff like this....
IMG_20220514_174327.jpg

With pragmatic engineering solutions like this:
IMG_20220515_140855.jpg

IMG_20220515_153706.jpg
 
Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
Well, I strongly suspect I may have to start the search for a new car in the morning. Just back home after being involved in a head-on collision with another car. The other driver was overtaking on a bendy road. The car she was overtaking was an unmarked police car so I doubt I'll have a problem proving no fault...

Ears still ringing from the full airbag deployment. Chest sore from the airbag. Lower legs sore from the impact. That said, one of the officers said I was very, very lucky given the closing speed. Definitely shaken and stirred.

IMG_20220519_222422_1.jpg

Full road closure, police and ambulances involved. Very professional the lot of them.

Brandy required...
 
adrian

adrian

Flying Squad
A like doesn't seem appropriate in the situation - but really glad to hear you are okay, although I suspect it may be a day or two before you realise the full extent of any physical injuries, that brandy (or 2) will probably be the best medicine for a day or two.
 
Pencarrow

Pencarrow

Western Thunderer
adrian said:
A like doesn't seem appropriate in the situation - but really glad to hear you are okay, although I suspect it may be a day or two before you realise the full extent of any physical injuries, that brandy (or 2) will probably be the best medicine for a day or two.
Click to expand...
Thanks Adrian, appreciated.
 
simond

simond

Western Thunderer
Wow, thats pretty scary. Glad you're ok. Shocking experience.

You might feel a bit mentally, as well as physically, battered over the next couple of days so look after yourself.
 
AJC

AJC

Western Thunderer
Crikey, Chris, that’s a fair size prang. I’m glad you’re ok, but do take it easy for a bit and be careful about the ringing ears, I tried concussion once - I had a cycling altercation with the bonnet of a Golf (which wasn’t where it should have been), didn’t like it.

Adam
 
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