7mm On Heather's Workbench - three is a magic number

phileakins

Western Thunderer
Thanks for taking me 'Round the Horne" Heather. Don't worry, I'll 'Take it from Here', are you sure Ron and Eth aren't in there somewhere?

Ah memories.

Mind you it don't half date me!

Phil

PS I'm sure 'On the Buses' started on radio so Blake is permissable.
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
The passengers have now been placed in their permanent locations.

The completed interiors were stuck to the underframes using double-sided tape. It seemed the most pragmatic solution, seeing as they will be fixed in place laterally by the roof bolts eventually. The end compartments have oval holes in them which coincide with the bogie bolts. Seeing as the "bolts" are actually embedded blocks which are flush with the floor, I painted them the same colour as the overlaying interior floor in order to camouflage them.

Standing passengers had 0.8mm diameter brass wire inserted into their feet, and holes drilled in the floor. Seated passengers had their backsides scraped and scored (!), and the same to the seats. A drop or two of superglue holds them in place.

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And so my attention returned to the sides.

With the client choice of using real glass for the glazing, I had been trying to work out how to fit the glazing nicely with the minimum of fuss. The problem, you see, is the sides are moulded with rebates for the plastic glazing, and the rebates have rounded corners. Now, while it would be possible to trim the glass with corners to suit, the wastage would be high. I know this because I've tried it. I got one cleanly trimmed pane out of three attempts.

The obvious solution would be to open out the corners so square cut glass pieces can be dropped in. My first thought was to use a grinding tool or even the milling machine to open out each corner. The complexity and potential for disaster can only be imagined. One turn of the mill head too far and a nice fat hole appears in the exterior of the coach, never mind actually holding the work on the bed.

I happen to have a nice chisel cutting tool. I don't know where it came from originally, but it was given to me by another modelling friend. I guess it may be a dental modelling tool, but it's become my go-to tool for cleaning back solder, castings, etches, for scraping and carving and all manner of tasks. The chisel point is about 1.5mm across, making it ideal for small tasks. I thought it might be useful for just nicking back the corners of the window rebates, so I tried.

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The window on the left is as it comes in the box. The window on the right has been tampered with to allow for square cut glazing. A lot less messy than a milling machine, and much less chance of causing damage.

I shall trim out all the remaining frames today - there is an awful lot on these coaches, after all! - and it looks like I shall prime the sides, and paint the interiors tomorrow. Once things are nice and dry, I guess I will have to break out the airbrush and get mixing with the carmine and cream. :thumbs:
 

JimG

Western Thunderer
The obvious solution would be to open out the corners so square cut glass pieces can be dropped in. My first thought was to use a grinding tool or even the milling machine to open out each corner. The complexity and potential for disaster can only be imagined. One turn of the mill head too far and a nice fat hole appears in the exterior of the coach, never mind actually holding the work on the bed.

Heather,

I'm actually milling some resin coach sides at the moment and my initial concern was how to hold them firmly without damaging them. I've worked out a system which is comparatively cheap and cheerful but has worked well so far. I won't go into detail at the moment since the project is someone else's on WT and it will be his call when details can be revealed.

I'm using CNC to do the cutting. That can do wonders for the adrenalin as you watch the cutter descend to the coach side and you pray that you've set up correctly. :)

Jim.
 

daifly

Western Thunderer
Heather
Is all of this necessary? Can you not get away with a rectangular pane within the framing as sketched below?
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Steph Dale

Western Thunderer
Heather
Is all of this necessary? Can you not get away with a rectangular pane within the framing as sketched below?


Or an octagonal one? I've mucked about with coverslips as part of a trial and successfully made windows with their corners trimmed off at 45 degrees...

Steph
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
Some of the windows, yes, I probably could have trimmed smaller. But in the interests of speed I plan to use the plastic precut glazing to create a set of templates for trimming the glass to size. That means I don't have to measure the existing window rebates to get the cut size for smaller bits of glass. Also, if my plan works, at most I'll need two cuts per window.

Octagonal, yes, again. More cuts, though, more chances for damage - especially in my ham-fisted way. This was one of the tests I made when I first got the glass on my workbench. I got through three slips trying things out, and felt that had to be an easier way than trying to trim corners.

Perhaps my idea and method is more than necessary, but I've had several weeks to think about this. As my experience with this new (to me) glazing method increases, perhaps I can get more adventurous. ;)
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
I've been quiet, but I've been busy. Apart from the current build, an LNWR all third driving trailer and accompanying all third trailer coach have arrived, not to mention an 9F that's materialised from somewhere. More about those another day.

Having opened out the window rebates, I have primed and painted the insides of the sides. While I ponder the next stage with the sides, attention has turned to the ends.

You may recall, so way back in this very thread, I had more or less completed the ends of the D94 as part of the test build. As my knowledge of the prototype has improved, I realised I made some silly errors. I decided now was as good a time as any to set about the gangways properly, and to fabricate the rather obviously missing suspension brackets.

Cue a desperate scrabble to recover the "instructions" from where I'd thrown them some time ago, and some flicking back and forth in the reference books to get some good views of the gangways. Luckily, the books have a nice clear three-quarter end view, and side views that show the gangways coupled and uncoupled. The "instructions" are somewhat less clear.

Essentially, imagine an A4 sheet in landscape. Imagine a block of thumbnail images, in a three by two grid. The first image shows the fret of gangway parts, the second shows the parts cut out and arranged neatly with the rubber concertina, something like this:

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My interpretation is a lot clearer as I just photographed one set, instead of both gangways at once. I've also added the cast suspension brackets.

Now, I don my fez, say the magic words "jesslike-a-darealthing" while waving my hands over the workbench - manic chuckle and grin optional - and the gangway is constructed. At least that's how the instructions show it. The third image is the completed gangway, sitting there like an ice cream sandwich, the black bellows stuck between the brass etches. The remaining images simply showing how it's glued to the end moulding of the coach, along with the steps. Not a clue of how the actual gangway parts fit together.

You might say it's obvious. Well, I would agree with you. The latch handle folds up, and fits over the little etched hole, through which you can stick a bit of wire. Presumably you can make it work "jesslike-a-darealthing" if you want. The bellows fit in the two central etches, the one with the rebate is glued to the end of the coach. The protective end plate is optional, and I will probably use it on the end of the third brake. So, what are the three little T-shaped bits for, and where do they go? It is all very far from clear, I have to say.

I think I shall simply pretend the T-pieces don't exist. Perhaps they're to help the end plate fix in place? I don't know. I'm guessing.

Happily, some of the scrap etch from the gangway fret is about the right width to help me fabricate the main hanging brackets. I'll show how I work that lot out - there's twelve to make, after all - in another post.
 

Ian G

Western Thunderer
I believe the 'T' shaped bits are to assist in joining gangways together in a rake, look on post 12 on my Syphon thread it has the CPL instructions for a suspended gangway, top of the picture between the 2 battery boxes show said 'T' shaped bits, I am sure if you build both gangways the same, they should mate together when in a rake, looking at the slots in your end, one would asume the same.
will take a better photo of said instructions later if it helps.

Regards

Ian G
 

Dikitriki

Flying Squad
To expand on Ian's point. The T's are soldered top and bottom on the left hand side only in the smaller holes in the half-etched rebate on the end plate. The cross part of the Ts on the adjacent connection engage in the larger slot on the right hand side top and bottom. I would enlarge the larger slot to make it a free rather than snap fit in case something gets pulled off when disengaging.

....or you can leave them off altogether. I'm not convinced there is enough movement in the bellows for normal model curves, especially reverse curves.

Richard
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
....or you can leave them off altogether. I'm not convinced there is enough movement in the bellows for normal model curves, especially reverse curves.

Thanks Richard, and Ian, too.

I think I'll leave them off. As you say, the bellows are fairly rigid, so I doubt they'll meet when the coaches are coupled up anyway! Funnily enough, I used one to beef up the clamp a little bit. :thumbs:

I'm currently fabricating one complete gangway so I can work out how big to make the suspension brackets. I have a horrid feeling they're going to have to be smaller than they should be, because the bellows don't extend out as far as the real thing seems to do. I guess it's one of those compromises you have to make every now and then.
 

Ian G

Western Thunderer
I have some close up photos of suspended gangways at home will post later if it helps.

Regards

Ian G
 

Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
That's fabulous, Ian! Thanks! :thumbs:

Interesting the Syphon has a different form of support bracket to the Colletts I see in the reference books. I shall investigate further.
 

Bob

Western Thunderer
Very nice modelling Heather:thumbs:

One photo attached which may be of use, remember when uncoupling a coach from a rake to disconnect the gangway as well..............not like these guys:eek: The noise was awful, the damage significant and the language.........rather blue !


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Heather Kay

Western Thunderer
One photo attached which may be of use, remember when uncoupling a coach from a rake to disconnect the gangway as well

:eek::))

I'm rather glad Ian posted his piccies when he did, because I've studied the photos again. I was all set to make suspension brackets, because the best photos I had showed the design where two bars are at an angle to the end of the coach, meeting at the suspension bar out in space. I also assumed these brackets were missing, either by error or design, from the JLTRT kits.

Now I've pored over the photos, many dim and indistinct, it's become apparent the C54, D94 and E127 all shared smaller variant of the "shelf bracket" style as shown for the Siphon.

:confused:

Then I checked the castings bags again, and found that is precisely what is included in the kits. Four sprues, each with one top bracket and a bottom bracket with a representation of the spring unit, making a pair for each gangway.

:oops:

Of course, muggins here elected to build the D94 as the test kit, and of course the D94 has two of those sprues missing. Guess who didn't notice, and was about to spend an inordinate amount of time making the wrong sort of brackets as replacements?

:rolleyes:

Guess who is also going to be on the phone to a certain Scottish gentleman in the morning!
 

Steph Dale

Western Thunderer
Very nice modelling Heather:thumbs:

One photo attached which may be of use, remember when uncoupling a coach from a rake to disconnect the gangway as well..............not like these guys:eek: The noise was awful, the damage significant and the language.........rather blue !


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Bob,

The Southern's Maunsell stock that was fitted with BS gangways seemed to suffer from this problem with alarming regularity for such a small number of vehicles; I suspect most of the problem was down to the vast majority of these vehicles having Pullman gangways so the small number of inter-regional Maunsell carriages got forgotten about in the hurly burly of the carriage yard.

I've therefore got a couple of photos of carriages with BS gangways pulled off. Strangely they don't seem to have caused quite the damage to the carriage itself that your pic shows. Perhaps it has something to do with the SR building this area strongly to take the buffing loads from the Pullman gangway - they were all built on the same drawings after all.

Heather,

Your thread keeps nagging at me; I've got a small batch of scratchbuilt/Slater's Maunsell carriages at the half way point which I really must get back to before they become a fixture in the shelf queens topic.

Apologies for the diversion (again), carriage nuttism will always out...

Steph
 
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